“Prey”
Written by Brannon Braga
Directed by Allan Eastman
Season 4, Episode 16
Production episode 184
Original air date: February 18, 1998
Stardate: 51652.3
Captain’s log. A Hirogen ship is chasing a bioship belonging to Species 8472. The two Hirogen track the lone creature to an asteroid where they finally corner it and shoot it to smithereens.
Voyager later comes across the same Hirogen ship, but it’s adrift with only one lifesign aboard. Against Seven’s loud recommendation, Janeway sends an away team over consisting of Chakotay, Tuvok, and Paris. They find a trophy room similar to the one Tuvok and Seven were imprisoned in last time, and Paris at one point comes across what he thinks is a helmet, but it turns out to still have the decapitated head of the beta Hirogen in it, scaring the bejabbers out of him.
They find the alpha, wounded, and beam him to Voyager‘s sickbay.
Chakotay and Tuvok are able to access the Hirogen’s computer, and they know a lot more about them now: They’re nomadic, with no single homeworld, and the hunt is the most important aspect of their society. Status is conferred by the quality of one’s prey and the difficulty level of a hunt.
The alpha regains consciousness in sickbay and refuses treatment. His immune system is powerful enough to resist every sedative in the EMH’s pharmacopeia. Janeway talks to him, convinces him that they’re trying to help and that he’ll die without treatment. Wanting to return to the hunt, the alpha allows himself to be treated.
Tuvok and Kim investigate a hull breach, which they thought was an overload, but the hull has been ripped open, and there’s blood. Examination of the blood reveals that it’s a fluidic lifeform, likely Species 8472, who are impervious to Starfleet sensors. Voyager goes on intruder alert. 8472 attacks engineering, wounding Torres.
The alpha says that 8472 is his prey. He’d thought he’d killed it, but it was more resilient than expected, broke free of its bonds on the Hirogen ship, killed the beta, and wounded the alpha. The Hirogen had been tracking it for fifty light-years. Other Hirogen ships are on their way to join the hunt. Janeway agrees to let the alpha join the hunt for the creature if he calls off his fellows. The alpha agrees.
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8472 is hunkered down on deck eleven, and has killed life support and artificial gravity. Tuvok has evacuated the deck, and he, Seven, Chakotay, Paris, and the alpha (all but the Hirogen in EVA suits with magnetic boots) patrol the deck in search of the creature. They find it near deflector control, wounded and barely moving. Tuvok has to stun the alpha to keep him from killing 8472, while 8472 also makes telepathic contact with Tuvok.
It becomes clear that 8472 is wounded, and was going to the deflector dish to open a singularity to get itself to fluidic space. It has no enmity toward anyone, it just wants to go home. Janeway wishes to send it home, thus pissing off the alpha (who is now again behind a force field in sickbay) and the other Hirogen. Worse, Seven is the only one with the skill to open a singularity, and she refuses to do so, as it is giving aid and comfort to the enemy.
Janeway confines Seven to the cargo bay and assigns Torres to figure out how to open a singularity. The Hirogen move to attack Voyager, as Janeway has declared the hunt of 8472 over, thus making Voyager their new target. The Hirogen attack, at one point temporarily disabling the force fields long enough for the alpha to escape sickbay.
Seven is allowed to leave the cargo bay to help defend the ship against the Hirogen. The alpha goes to where 8472 is recuperating, and attacks it. Seven accesses the transporter and beams both the alpha and 8472 to one of the Hirogen ships. The Hirogen all retreat.
Janeway is livid at Seven for disobeying orders. Seven points out the logical fallacy of Janeway trying to make Seven become more individual and then punishing her for having a mind of her own, but Janeway reminds her that there’s still a hierarchy on Voyager.
Can’t we just reverse the polarity? Torres finds herself incapable of opening a singularity using Voyager‘s engines. Apparently, in all this time, Seven never showed anyone how to do it.
There’s coffee in that nebula! Janeway rips Seven a new one for disobeying orders, though her very lax enforcement of the chain of command generally, especially with regards to Seven up until now in order to encourage her individuality, makes her insubordination perhaps a bit predictable.
Mr. Vulcan. Just as 8472 communicated with Kes telepathically in the “Scorpion” two-parter, it does likewise with Tuvok here.
Everybody comes to Neelix’s. At one point, Tuvok deputizes Neelix to join the security force, marking the third time we’ve seen Tuvok do this, but the first time he’s done so in a timeline that has remained intact. (The others were in “Before and After” and the “Year of Hell” two-parter, both due to the Krenim threat.)
Resistance is futile. Seven objects to sending an away team to the Hirogen ship given the risks, though she does later admit that the intel they gained was worth that risk. However, she absolutely refuses to do anything to help 8472, and not only refuses to obey Janeway’s order to help send it home, but takes over the transporter and sends 8472 to the Hirogen ship. (While Janeway says Seven has condemned 8472 to death, I’m not 100% convinced that it’s the Hirogen who will come out on top of that fight…)
Please state the nature of the medical emergency. The EMH is trying to help Seven, um, assimilate (sorry) into humanity by teaching her how to make small talk. He says it was a big help to him when he was first activated. Seven herself is a bit dubious as to the exercise’s efficacy, but she gives it a shot.
Do it.
“Surrender the creature to me, and you will not be harmed.”
“This isn’t a hunt, it’s a slaughter—and I’m calling it off right now.”
“We will not be denied our prey. Give us the creature or your crew will take its place.”
–The alpha setting terms, Janeway saying fuck you, and the alpha saying fuck you right back.
Welcome aboard. The big guest is the great Tony Todd in his third Trek role as the alpha Hirogen, having previously played Kurn in three episodes of TNG and one of DS9, as well as the older Jake Sisko in DS9’s “The Visitor.”
In addition, Clint Carmichael plays the ill-fated beta Hirogen. He previously played one of the Nausicaans who stabbed Ensign Jean-Luc Picard in the heart in TNG‘s “Tapestry.”
Trivial matters: In addition to continuing Voyager‘s encounters with the Hirogen following “Message in a Bottle” and “Hunters,” this episode also picks up on Species 8472 from “Scorpion, Part II.” The lone 8472 was left behind when its fellows retreated to fluidic space in that episode. How it then got more than 10,000 light-years away (since Voyager was sent that far at the end of “The Gift“) is left unclear.
That 8472 transits to this universe from fluidic space via singularities was established in the “Scorpion” two-parter.
The Hirogen will next be seen two episodes hence in the two-parter “The Killing Game.” Species 8472 will next be seen in the fifth season’s “In the Flesh.”
Set a course for home. “Your decision is tactically unsound.” This is another really powerful episode, continuing the superb introduction of the Hirogen as antagonists, with the added bonus of Tony Todd absolutely killing it as the alpha. In 2001, I wrote a Trek novel called Demons of Air and Darkness in which a Hirogen appeared, and I used Todd as the basis for the character, because he just nailed it.
The whole opening sequence is beautifully done, with Todd’s alpha strategizing and very obviously respecting 8472’s status as prey. And Todd’s superb performance continues throughout, as he never loses sight of his goal to capture 8472. Everything he does is in service of that, and I love how free of bluster the alpha is—he just wants to complete his hunt, nothing more, nothing less. I also like his matter-of-fact tactical analyses throughout.
A lot of people talk about this episode in terms of how it moves the Janeway-Seven relationship forward, and I actually think this is where the episode falls down a bit. Seven’s insubordination makes total sense, mind you. The Borg have no concept of compassion and their method of learning stuff is to assimilate the whole culture, so neither the initial away team nor Janeway’s later desire to send the wounded 8472 home make any sense to her at all. And her solution is a much nastier version of Scotty’s solution to the tribble infestation at the end of “The Trouble with Tribbles,” which is to send everyone off together on their own ship and fight it out.
But her conclusion at the end is completely off base. Janeway herself says that individuality only goes so far when there’s a hierarchical chain of command, but Seven’s riposte that Janeway is afraid of her individuality is given more air time and more weight, and a lame response by Janeway (“As you were”) makes it clear that the message the script wants to convey is that Seven’s right.
And she isn’t. Not even a little bit. Janeway isn’t frightened of Seven’s individuality; she simply disagreed with her. It’s not the first time she’s disagreed with a subordinate—she’s gone against the advice of the people under her command plenty of times, including that of her best friend and her trusted exec.
The real issue here is the one brought up by Torres in “Message in a Bottle” just two episodes ago: They’ve given Seven way too much latitude. They’re encouraging her individuality so much that they’re letting her get away with shit they shouldn’t be letting her get away with. In fact, in that very episode, Seven imperiously summons Janeway and Chakotay to astrometrics, and do the captain and first officer upbraid their subordinate for being so high-handed with the two people in charge? No, they laugh it off. That laxity is what led to Seven disobeying orders here.
Finally, often lost in the hugger-mugger about Janeway and Seven and the awesomeness of Tony Todd is the fact that this is another great episode for Chakotay. We get to see his inner anthropologist geek out over what he learns about the Hirogen, and then he has a great moment where he slaps down the alpha, saying that it’s his hunt. Robert Beltran plays it perfectly, with Chakotay using the Hirogen’s own cultural norms against him to reassert his own authority.
Note: There will be no Voyager Rewatch on Thursday the 26th due to the Thanksgiving holiday (though there will be a review of “Unification III,” this week’s Discovery episode, on that day). We’ll be back on Monday the 30th with “Retrospect.”
Warp factor rating: 9
Keith R.A. DeCandido‘s next novel is Animal, a thriller he wrote with Dr. Munish K. Batra, about a serial killer who targets people who harm animals. It’s now available for preorder, and if you preorder it directly from WordFire Press, you get a free urban fantasy short story by Keith.
I really like the Hirogen (I always love the idea of more nomadic species/ groups in space, and it wasn’t something Trek spent a lot of time exploring, so I like it here), and no one ever went wrong casting Tony Todd in anything- and he is especially awesome in his Trek work. I am always impressed by how much subtle emotion he manages to convey under piles of prosthetics and make up, both here and as Kurn (to say nothing of how wonderful he is without the make-up in “The Visitor”).
I also like the tension between Seven and Janeway. That kind of character dynamic is, frankly, what we should have seen more of throughout the show, with other characters. Something the writers on DS9 were good at writing, and Sisko (in-universe) was good at dealing with was balancing competing requirements from groups of people who didn’t always see eye-to-eye on things. He was good at knowing when to crack down, when to cut people some slack, when to help them out, when to look the other way, and when to just tell them all to shut up and get in line. When Voyager first premiered I was hoping for more of that- a chance to see a Captain work not with the best of the best all the time, but also with people who had their own agendas, priorities, and principles. Early in Voyager’s run it was pretty much decided that there was going to be no (intentional) compromises of the Starfleet way of doing things, which I think is too bad. The crew depends on Janeway, but Janeway also has to depend on the crew, and given that 1/3 of them are pressed into service, and all of them are trapped decades from home, it really should have been more of a reality. That was rarely shown, but it is here, and I think it really works.
Forgive me Keith but i strongly disagree with you saying that the writers agree with Seven lashing out Janeway, the Captain got the last word you called it lame but i thought it was stoic and dignified she already made her point anything more would have been unclassy.
The first few Hirogen episodes are unusual from a structural perspective. They’re featured in three episodes in a row, but each one is a standalone story. Even the consecutive ones with linked titles, “Hunters” and “Prey,” don’t share a single plot; the prey in the latter episode is not the same one the hunters were after in the former. The fact that the titular “Prey” is a callback to a different 2-parter altogether further complicates it.
But it shows that VGR by this point was doing a better job making use of its continuity — building up arc elements and then combining them in interesting ways.
What always surprised me about the Hirogen’s makeup is how non-intimidating they look with their helmets off. Their heads have these soft curvy shapes, in contrast to the sharp-edged or spiky look of other alien designs like Jem’Hadar and Klingons. This time it’s their armor that has all the ridgy and angular bits. It’s an interesting two-layer design.
As we will see in future episodes and seasons, they definitely turned the entire show into the Seven of Nine Power Hour, and I lost interest in large part because of that.
While the conflict between Seven and Janeway was good, I think the writers weren’t as deft as they could have been in giving Seven opportunities to disagree with Janeway. At the briefing in Janeway’s ready room, it seemed like the only reason Seven was there was so she could object to the plan. I found Seven’s sudden appearance in that scene to be jarring.
The punish Seven got here should have been levied after Message in a Bottle when she assaulted an alien during diplomatic negotiations. While beaming the member of species 8472 off the ship was a more severe act, it’s same in kind.
Though I think Seven would have beamed them off the ship even if she knew Janeway was going to discipline her for it. It’s still too soon for the mere fact of Janeway’s disapproval to hold significant weight for Seven.
@4/JasonD: I’ve already debunked that assumption repeatedly, based on the count I did for a Star Trek Magazine article on the subject in 2009. In season 4, Janeway and Seven were the focus of the episode’s main plot about equally often, but in seasons 5 and 6, Janeway was most frequently the central character, with Seven second and the Doctor third; and in season 7, the Doctor moved into second place and Seven fell to third.
To quote from my article, “So out of her 103 episodes as a series regular (counting the two-hour “Endgame” as one), Seven of Nine was the central character in 32, just under a third. Adding major supporting roles brings the number closer to half. That seems like a lot for one member of an ensemble of nine. But keep in mind that most episodes center on more than one character. Seven-centric episodes usually featured another regular, most often Kathryn Janeway or the Doctor, with equal prominence. And her supporting roles were often as a member of the ensemble rather than a sole focus.”
Hey, my own rewatch has actually caught up to this rewatch! I really enjoyed this episode and have forgotten how strong the first several Hirogen episodes are. I also liked that it doesn’t end with Seven learning a little lesson about compassion. She just doesn’t get it and she’s not going to, at least not at this point in her development. I do wish that they bulked up Janeway’s side of the argument a little more. I had the same feeling as Krad, that their last exchange is framed as though Seven is right (and Janeway’s “As you were” was a lame response to Seven’s accusation).
Janeway’s story of the wounded Cardassian they helped during the war also wasn’t a great choice to try to convince Seven. Honestly, I don’t think it really convinced me either. I’ll never understand why Janeway didn’t try a more empathetic argument. This particular 8472 is trapped in the Delta quadrant with no allies and is just trying to get home… sounds pretty familiar. Seven and Voyager were enemies until she was severed from the collective. Parallelly, this 8472 was an enemy of Seven’s but it has now been cut off from the rest of its people. It’s no longer her enemy. I still don’t think it would’ve convinced Seven, but it would have been a better approach than asking her to do something tactically stupid just because it would “put her in touch with her humanity.”
@5
Agreed. Seven wasn’t even on a “Better to do it and apologize than ask for permission and be denied” tip, because she wasn’t in the least bit sorry.
I was saddened that Janeway didn’t nail Seven to the wall with the fact that only a few months ago she was the threat that could’ve just as easily been ejected from the ship and left for dead. Janeway’s compassion is meaningful. Saving that Undine could’ve created a basis for peace and understanding, started building some trust.
Tony Todd is genius as always bringing the perfect blend of intimidating and intelligence, all thanks to that magnificent voice.
I’m curious how the Hirogen would interact with the Gamma Quadrant Hunters.
John: Nothing to forgive. Agreeing with me is not at all required! Yours is a perfectly reasonable interpretation of that last scene…..
—Keith R.A. DeCandido
8: “I was saddened that Janeway didn’t nail Seven to the wall with the fact that only a few months ago she was the threat that could’ve just as easily been ejected from the ship and left for dead.”
I love the scene where they establish that Janeway is a veteran of the Cardassian War and she tells the story about saving a Cardassian’s life. There’s two points I wish the script found a way for them to use against the other:
1) The point you make, by Seven’s logic Janeway should have just fragged Seven (and, actually, did frag all of Seven’s co-drones by sending them into space, Seven just survived out of fortuity). Hmmmm.
2) During the first Cardassian War, Janeway bravely saved the life of a Cardassian soldier! Who, if he’s alive today… is most likely part of the Dominion war machine and out there somewhere trying to kill members of Starfleet. Hmmmm.
@8- If we go back to “The Most Dangerous Game,” as the source for this sort of thing, then the likely conclusion to finding an expert hunter who knows all the tricks but meets whatever social definition you have for prey (do Hirogens hunt other Hirogens?) is probably “Oh, goody, a real challenge.”
Then again, since we’ll see attempts to reform Hirogen culture and redirect the nature of hunts, it’s also possible that a thoughtful Hirogen might think that this whole “Dedicated genetically engineered quarry species,” has a lot going for it, although I get the sense that Hirogen culture would rather add some fangs and claws, and maybe a gland to let them spit plasma, rather than just have them be good at running and hiding.
“Seven, what you call a threat, I call an opportunity to gain knowledge about this species.”
So, after the tease of a couple of episodes where the focus is really on the relay network, we finally get to spend some proper time with the Hirogen. The result is a fail for Janeway on just about every level. She sees an opportunity to build bridges with two old enemies but neither works out the way she wants. And indeed she fails with a third. She tries to give Seven an inspirational speech about saving an injured Cardassian in the middle of a war with them, only to find it makes no impact on her whatsoever. The episode starts out being about the conflict between the Hirogen and Species 8472 but slowly morphs into being about the conflict between Janeway’s Starfleet idealism and Seven’s pragmatism. The result is an ending where Seven saves the ship but in doing so almost certainly gets the 8472 and/or several Hirogen killed. It’s a very uncomfortable, un-Star Trek resolution.
It’s a shame that the series can’t follow through on it. This should have been followed with at least an episode or two of Seven under restrictions. Instead, we get plunged straight into another Seven-centric episode which opens with Janeway deciding that she’s behaved herself since the last episode so everything’s back to normal.
Another mention of Kes (in a scene that came a lot earlier than I thought it did, I didn’t think the Doctor trying to teach Seven manners came until Season 5): I note that the Doctor came up with an excuse to tell her she looks lovely! I think that’s the first time we see Seven in a senior staff meeting. It’s not clear how she wrangled that since she doesn’t really have anything to contribute: Janeway seems to have invited her along just to say “I told you so.” Neelix being deputised as a security officer is a fairly thin excuse to have him in the episode. He also calls Tuvok “Lieutenant” despite his promotion back in “Revulsion”.
Season 4 continuing to impress with its solid consistency. This is a very good stretch of episodes. I think it’s more than safe to say this is when the show really found its footing and its identity. Seasons 1 and 2 had highs and lows – mostly lows – but mostly problematic. Season 3 was a transitional period. 4 is where the magic is finally working. Where the show found its groove (not unlike DS9’s own fourth season).
Prey is a good example of character evolution while still adhering to the episodic format, even though it’s all callbacks to prior shows: the Hirogen; Species 8472.
I don’t agree with @krad’s assessment that Seven’s retort to Janeway is necessarily off-base. There’s a conscious effort from Braga and the writers to characterize the Seven/Janeway relationship as a mother/daughter dynamic, and specifically a teenage daughter dynamic. And I don’t think it was Braga’s intention to paint Seven as the right one in that confrontation.
Let’s put it this way. Several months ago, Seven was, for all intents and purposes, forcibly removed and thus isolated from the only home she’s ever known, even though it was a stifling, rigid and abusive Borg environment. That was a literal system shock on her. On Voyager, she has since gained unprecedented freedom and even emotional support. She’s not at all used to this. Obviously, she’s testing her limits to see how far she can push before Janeway imposes a line. The past three episodes have showed Seven pushing it. Shocking Idrin in Hunters being the most blatant example. It’s been an intentional developing arc.
So, when Seven claims that Janeway is frightened of her individuality, she’s actually coming from that same emotional place as when she slugged Janeway on The Gift. This is a confused child, still struggling to find her place in this new universe. That’s why it’s given that much airtime (plus, any VOY writer would want to write extra dialogue since Ryan will sell it). She even assumes that Janeway is disappointed she isn’t becoming more like her. Janeway’s “As you were” isn’t that lame. It’s a way of putting an end to indulging Seven’s protests.
Besides all that, we get a superb Hirogen story out of the episode. You can’t go wrong with Tony Todd as Alpha. He has presence, conviction and drive, making for a superb antagonist. And with this, Voyager turns a corner with Species 8472, giving a much necessary Trekkian spin on the race, making it clear they’re as vulnerable as the Borg were to them, and they’re entitled to exist unharmed. Great CGI, also.
Brannon Braga is at his comfort zone when he writes scenes with the crew prowling darkened corridors looking for the shadowy threat. It’s one of the reasons why Prey works so well. Direction plays a big hand here too. I can’t speak for how production was being scheduled back then, but I also figure this episode is the reason director Allan Eastman ended up being assigned to DS9’s Honor Among Thieves, shot around the same time, and ended up doing a very good job with the O’Brien/Bilby scenes.
^^Even though that DS9 episode isn’t all that great.
@6:) It very well could be confirmation bias on my part, good on you for doing that level of research.
@13:
I think it’s more than safe to say this is when the show really found its footing and its identity. Seasons 1 and 2 had highs and lows – mostly lows – but mostly problematic. Season 3 was a transitional period. 4 is where the magic is finally working. Where the show found its groove (not unlike DS9’s own fourth season).
Yeah, “Scorpion” in many ways feels like a second Pilot in the same way “The Way of the Warrior” was for DS9.
And yeah, Season 4 is really when it became, for better and for worse, the VOY we think of.
@14:
Even though [“Honor Among Thieves”] isn’t all that great.
No, it’s not a favorite DS9 episode of mine, either.
Actually, speaking of “Honor Among Thieves”, I’ve always though the Orion Syndicate’s presence on DS9 was a missed opportunity for the spinoff and for Trek as a whole.
The Orions one of the franchise’s oldest antagonists, but like the Romulans they’d never really been fleshed out. So even though the lion’s share of the appearances was on DS9, I wish more world building had been done (especially as their only subsequent appearance since was in the final Season of ENT).
(3)
I was just thinking the same about the Hirogen design. I wonder what inspired their look. Sort of, I dunno, a cross between a cat, a long-nosed monkey, and E.T.? They’re definitely not as intimidating underneath the armor, which is a nice Star Trekkie kind of surprise.
@7/Fry08: You make excellent points about all the parallels in this situation, and those points definitely should have been made to Seven of Nine. Janeway’s backstory about her service during the Cardassian War was a good addition to the Janeway mythos, but sadly it’s utterly wasted on Seven. The parallels you point out should have been the conversation; they probably wouldn’t have convinced Seven, but still should have been pointed out.
Seven was definitely 100% wrong here. Janeway reaming Seven was definitely satisfying. I have to agree that Janeway’s “As you were” was not lame; it was telling the upstart child to “Go to your room.” Janeway not turning around and simply saying “As you were” meant this discussion is over, and Janeway got the last word. Do not piss off Mama Bear.
I remember being horrified when I first watched this how Seven, with almost no thought, sent a sentient being, who just wanted to return home, to it’s likely death. Watching this a couple days ago, I was again horrified. Janeway should have given Seven the “Thirty Days” treatment here, or some version of that.
Finally, Tony Todd kills it here. I was hanging on his Alpha’s every word. Just a subtle, compelling performance. It’s Tony Todd’s Hirogen Alpha that defined the Hirogen for me, and it’s this string of episodes that define Season 4 of Voyager for me.
I never understood the perception that Voyager became the Janeway/Doctor/Seven of Nine show after Jeri Ryan joined the cast. I watched Voyager when it aired in its entirety, and several times since then. Were those three featured heavily? Absolutely. Did the other characters never get feature stories after Seven of Nine? Definitely not. Just look at “Extreme Risk” at the top of next season, as just one example.
Also, as Krad points out, Chakotay has quite a bit more to do than he’s given credit for.
@18, You know, it never even occurred to me to compare it to what happened in “Thirty Days,” but you are totally right! I don’t know why Seven gets sent to her room and has her toys taken away here, but Paris is subject to what many mental health and criminal justice advocates even today classify as torture. Paris’ punishment always seemed overly harsh to me (as did Ensign Kim becoming the only person in the history of space travel to get an official reprimand for having entirely consensual sex with an alien), but after this episode it also just seems unfair.
@18/Dante: I agree about “As you were.” It’s not the captain backing down and surrendering the argument; on the contrary, it’s the captain asserting her military authority to shut down the debate. It’s the point where she stops giving Seven license to act out and starts treating her like a subordinate, required to shut up and stand down when the captain orders her to.
As for the dominance of Seven and the Doctor versus the other characters, I’ll repeat what I’ve said before: When I got a chance to pitch for season 5, I tried to avoid coming up with Seven and Doctor stories because I figured everyone else would, so I wanted to offer the producers something different. But ultimately most of the ideas I came up with were Seven or Doctor stories. They were the only ones it was easy to build stories around, because they had so much more potential for character growth and interpersonal conflict than the other cast members, who had all pretty much resolved their defining character arcs by this point. In the last few seasons, the only real ongoing character arc we get besides the evolution of the Doctor and Seven is the Paris-Torres relationship. Everyone else just sort of treads water for the rest of the series.
So Seven and the Doctor dominated because they deserved to, because they were both fantastically rich characters brilliantly portrayed. The problem was that most of the other characters were pretty boring in comparison.
‘Hunters’ was good, but ‘Prey’ was So. Much. Better.
It helps that the episode actually focuses on the Hirogen in a way that it’s immediate precursor doesn’t quite have the time to (the crews focus always seems more on the array than on the newly-contacted species keeping them from having any easy access to it) but what really sells this new problem as an ongoing challenge and a fascinating People in their own right is the Mighty Todd, who really sells this alien mindset like a Ferengi in a bull market.
It strikes me that his success in this episode is quite comparable to that of Mr David Warner in ‘Chain of Command’ (taking a previously established antagonist species and making them matter going forward; instantly recognisable and complete unto themselves, fit to challenge Our Heroes and hold the attention of audiences as something more than just the weekly curiosity).
Of course the gold standard for this sort of performance remains Mr Mark Lenard in ‘Balance of Terror’ (who does all this in a single d— episode and thereby staked a place for the Romulans as a key element of STAR TREK that they’ve held onto for over half a century).
The most excellent Mr Todd aside, the cast also does yeoman work in this episode – and I definitely agree that Mr Chakotay putting the Alpha Hirogen into second place is quite possibly the Best in the whole show (with the latter’s glare at a suddenly meek Mr Paris the icing on the cake) – with Seven of Nine’s contretemps with Captain Janeway offering an especially interesting opening for further development of their personal & professional relationship.
Also, the Yautja from PREDATOR are definitely the most applicable point of comparison with the Hirogen, but it’s intriguing how much being able to hold a conversation can shape one’s appreciation of a species (this definitely gives the Hirogen a more Science-Fiction, less Horror movie feel).
@22:
Of course the gold standard for this sort of performance remains Mr Mark Lenard in ‘Balance of Terror’ (who does all this in a single d— episode and thereby staked a place for the Romulans as a key element of STAR TREK that they’ve held onto for over half a century).
Yeah, it’s definitely an interesting phenomenon within the franchise, isn’t it?
An actor or actress and their performance can make all the difference between whether or not an alien race remains just an ‘Alien of the Week’, or become part of the larger tapestry for years or even decades later.
The Romulans had Lenard, as you said. The Klingons had John Colicos (and, to a lesser extent, William Campbell and Michael Ansara). The Q had John DeLancie. The Cardassians had Marc Alaimo…well, technically as Macet in “The Wounded” rather than as Dukat. But Alaimo arguably left enough of an impression in “The Wounded” to make the Cardassians interesting enough to return down the road (and, heh, return they did).
And then of course, you can have actors salvage a one-shot or recurring alien race that had misfired. DS9 has some of the most triumphant examples of this. Armin Shimmerman, Max Grodénchik, and Aaron Eisenberg all saved the Ferengi after TNG. Jeffrey Combs’ likewise brought the Vorta back into focus after they’d been sidelined following “The Search” (and did the same with the Andorians in ENT after they’d barely appeared following TOS).
@24/Mr. Magic: “Armin Shimmerman, Max Grodénchik, and Aaron Eisenberg all saved the Ferengi after TNG.”
Although Shimerman played the leader of the Ferengi landing party in their debut episode, “The Last Outpost” and the Marauder captain in “Peak Performance,” neither of which is all that well-regarded as a Ferengi episode. And Grodénchik had previously played Ferengi in “Captain’s Holiday” and “The Perfect Mate.” So I don’t think it can be attributed to the actor alone. It’s the blend of the performance and the writing.
@25,
Heh, whoops.
That’s right, I’d forgotten Shimmerman’s admitted he felt guilty about “The Last Outpost” and one incentive for playing Quark was to rehabilitate the Ferengi.
But you’re also absolutely right about the writing too. If the Ferengi hadn’t had advocates like Behr in the DS9 Writers Room or some of the early Ferengi episodes, the rehabilitation wouldn’t have been half as successful. Behr alone gave us the Rules of Acquisition.
And speaking of Behr and the Ferengi, this excerpt from his and Robert Hewitt Wolfe’s Legends of the Ferengi never, ever fails to make me laugh:
17822 was a very interesting year on Ferenginar. In that year alone, over twenty thousand Grand Nagi held office; the Ferengi Financial Exchange crashed 3152 times, while setting 12322 record highs; there were 41098 civil wars; an unknown number of Ferengi-incited interstellar wars (estimates are in the millions); and the Ferengi sun went nova at least once a week.
In other words, 17822 was the year Ferenginar discovered time travel.
(and did the same with the Andorians in ENT after they’d barely appeared following TOS).
@24: The reason the Andorians were nowhere to be seen after the Original Series has more to do with a desire to break away from that era than not finding the right actor. Early TNG had Roddenberry trying to differentiate the show from its predecessor, and that meant avoiding familiar faces and elements from the 60’s. So the Andorians and Tellarites were mostly off-limits. Even Vulcans had very little presence on TNG, aside from the brief Sarek/Spock appearances. And then Berman wanted the 24th century spinoff shows to reflect that same sleek, modern aesthetic. So, bringing designs so closely idenfitied with the 1960’s wasn’t something they were willing to do.
Obviously, by the time they got to Enterprise in 2001, it was evident were going to have to involve Andorians in the plot, since they were already firmly established as founding members of the Federations alongside Humans, Vulcans and Tellarites. Getting Combs – an established DS9 player – to play the role of Shran was certainly beneficial, but they were already headed that way, regardless of his casting.
@27/Eduardo: Canonical Trek had established nothing whatsoever, firm or otherwise, about who the founders of the Federation were; that was strictly fan lore, an assumption based on the fact that Vulcans, Andorians, and Tellarites were the only recurring nonhuman Federation species that TOS had depicted. ENT did eventually establish those species as founders alongside humanity, but it was the very first canonical production to do so, and was certainly under no obligation to do so if its creators had wanted to go in a different direction. (A scrapbook page created for Generations used the traditional fan-lore founders of Earth, Vulcan, Tellar, Andor, and Alpha Centauri, but it did not appear onscreen, so it doesn’t count.)
I think there were various reasons ENT focused on the Andorians — partly that a lot of the staffers at that point were lifelong fans who wanted to explore such elements, partly because a prequel logically needed to show the first meetings with known civilizations rather than focusing solely on new ones, and partly because the producers decided that animatronic technology had finally gotten to the point where they could affordably do something interesting with Andorian antennae rather than having them just sit there.
@28:
..and partly because the producers decided that animatronic technology had finally gotten to the point where they could affordably do something interesting with Andorian antennae rather than having them just sit there.
Yeah, to say nothing of the advances in prosthetic makeup (and an actual budget) to better depict the Tellarites instead of being just a guy wearing a, for all intents, pig mask.
Actually, given how DSC tweaked and updated the Andorian and Tellarite makeup, I’d be curious to see PIC do the same with some of the 24th Century races (the Ferengi and Cardassians especially).
@29/Mr. Magic: There was nothing about Michael Westmore’s Tellarite makeup that required more budget or technical advancement than his Klingon or Ferengi or Vidiian or Hirogen makeups. It was just one more of the hundreds of purely prosthetic designs he’d done, with no animatronics involved. Making them less porcine was purely a matter of design choices. They could’ve easily included Tellarites in the TNG-era shows; they just didn’t want to, because of a preference to avoid the ’60s makeup designs that were seen as kitschy. By the time of ENT, though, there were more producers on board who wanted to bring back TOS aliens, and they’d been successful with the Andorians, so it was only a matter of time before they got around to it.
@28 & 30. ChristopherLBennett: Cometh the hour, cometh the extraterrestrial, eh? (or if one wants to put it in Vintage Ferengi “Pay* us the budget and we’ll sell you the toys”).
*This word started out as ‘Give’ but I’m sure a thousand thousand generations of Ferengi would pay for my liquidation if one insinuated that such a pro bono sort of word hand anything to do with their native tongue …
@31,
Yeah, speaking of the Ferengi and finance, heh…as I’ve gotten older, the inherent paradox of the TNG-era Trek has amused me more and more.
Roddenberry’s TNG-era viewpoint was that the humanity ofTrek had moved beyond capitalistic pursuits and money didn’t exist…and yet the whole point of the franchise was, and still is, to generate income and IP for Paramount.
It’s not unlike the similar ironic paradox with how Star Wars was a story about rebels fighting against an evil empire…and then the franchise ended up being, for all intents, annexed by an evil empire (i.e. Disney).
@32. Mr. Magic: Well the Ferengi had to come from somewhere after all and every creation reflects some aspect of their creator … (-;
I think the thing that I can always most vividly remember about this episode without even rewatching it is when Seven beams the lone Species 84172 alien over to the Hirogen ship and feeling very sad for the alien, and disgusted by her action, because she most likely condemned it to death when all it wanted to do was get home.
Excellent performances by Tony Todd and Jeri Ryan and Kate Mulgrew. I do like the tense exchange between the latter two characters at the end of the show because it’s well acted and written and you can see both sides to the argument (while still clearly disagreeing with Seven). And of course it’s great internal character conflict on the series when it largely avoided it while even having a whole premise built up around it (the Maquis vs. Starfleet).
And I echo other’s points that this series quickly seemed to become like the Seven of Nine show. Yes, doing counts of episodes that spotlighted her may have shown that she was actually third or so in most number of episodes per season behind other characters, but it was pretty obvious that she was the writers’ shiny new toy to play with and explore. And I get that because she is an interesting character. But it just seemed like episode after episode seemed to prominently highlight her and shun a lot of the other characters. The character that shines a light on humanity or is an artificial life form are obvious fan favorites in various Star Trek series but there’s no reason the writers on Voyager couldn’t have made their human characters like Chakotay or Kim more interesting. I felt like the writers on DS9 were able to achieve this with O’Brien and Bashir.
@34/garreth: I agree that the writers failed to make the characters other than Seven and the Doctor as interesting as they could have. But that’s something to hold against the other characters, not against Seven. And I feel that the way people focus their complaints on Seven, ignoring the fact that the Doctor was featured just about as prominently, is sexist, an embrace of the categorically false and insulting narrative that she was emphasized solely for her sex appeal.
Anyway, the same thing happened with Spock on TOS. The show was originally meant as more of an ensemble piece, but Spock became the breakout star due to the actor’s talent, charisma, and sex appeal, so he ended up becoming the primary focus character of the series to the detriment of the overall ensemble, save only for the two characters closest to him, the captain and the doctor. At least Seven’s prominence was dialed down a bit after her first season. Spock got more dominant with each passing season.
@36/CLB: No where have I stated I’m against Seven or displaying a sexist attitude regarding her or that she got so much attention solely for her sex appeal. She was one of my favorite characters and Jeri Ryan is great actress. My complaint was that upon her introduction it seemed like she was heavily featured episode after episode after episode rather than having her main appearances spread more gingerly apart. My frustration was with the writers not trying to figure out how to make the other existing characters more interesting rather than diving head in and having Seven everywhere from jump.
@37/garreth: I don’t see how it’s wrong or even particularly unusual to focus heavily on a new character in their early episodes. You need to establish who they are and how they relate to the other characters. And in Seven’s particular case, it made sense that she’d have a busy, turbulent period of adjustment, given all she needed to learn and her resistance to accepting her role as an integral member of the crew. It’s different from, say, adding Worf to the DS9 ensemble, because he was used to being a member of a Starfleet crew and following the chain of command. So it wasn’t as much of a struggle to get him to accept his place in the crew, and thus he didn’t dominate the storylines as much. In Seven’s case, it would’ve been out of character for her to fit in that readily, so pacing out her storylines more widely wouldn’t really have made sense at this stage.
@36/CLB: I’d have said that TOS was originally intended as a show about Captain Kirk, with Spock as second banana and the rest of the crew as supporting guest characters: It’s very noticeable in the first season that you can go several episodes without Scotty, Sulu or Uhura appearing. It quickly became obvious that Spock was the more popular character so he was basically moved up to equal billing with Kirk in all but name, with McCoy getting the same treatment to provide a bit of balance. The rest were pretty much contracted on an episode by episode basis at least until the third season, it’s just as the show went on they began to have a recognisable set of supporting characters who appeared in most episodes rather than the revolving door bridge crew of the early days. Star Trek didn’t really become an ensemble where the captain and first officer could take a back seat for a week and let one of the other crew carry an episode until TNG.
@39/cap-mjb: Yes, of course Shatner and Nimoy were the only season-1 leads, as was typical for ’60s shows, but if you look at the actual episodes, the supporting characters get much more business and interplay than they got later on. You have the bridge crew’s banter in “The Corbomite Maneuver,” all the stuff with Sulu and Rand arguing about his plants in “The Man Trap,” Sulu’s shirtless swordfighting in “The Naked Time,” etc. They’re supporting characters, yes, but they’re still substantial parts of the stories in ways that diminished greatly as the focus solidified around the core trio. A notable example is “This Side of Paradise,” where a planned Sulu romance storyline was rewritten for Spock.
To clarify, I’m not saying early TOS was an ensemble show in the same way modern shows are, where all the leads are equal. I’m saying it was an ensemble show relative to 1960s-70s standards — centered on 2-3 leads, but still devoting a fair amount of ongoing attention to its supporting players and occasionally giving them subplots of their own. Early TOS was willing to give more business to the supporting characters that later episodes would’ve given only to Kirk, Spock, McCoy, and sometimes Scott. (Just look at “Spock’s Brain” — the one time in later TOS that Sulu, Uhura, and Chekov really get to shine in a bridge scene is when Spock isn’t there to hog all the exposition and problem-solving.)
“The rest were pretty much contracted on an episode by episode basis at least until the third season”
My understanding is that they were signed in advance to appear in a set number of episodes per season.
” it’s just as the show went on they began to have a recognisable set of supporting characters who appeared in most episodes rather than the revolving door bridge crew of the early days.”
That is blatantly counterfactual. First off, Janice Rand was intended as the female lead; Grace Lee Whitney was about equal to DeForest Kelley in credit billing, and was promoted as a third lead alongside Shatner and Nimoy in the publicity materials. She was in six of the first seven episodes of season 1, and seven of the first ten. She was only dropped because of the actress’s personal issues behind the scenes.
Second, Scott, Sulu, and Uhura were semi-regular members of the ensemble from the start of season 1, and of course Scott and Sulu had been in the second pilot as well. Counting the pilot, Scott was in 6 of the first 10 episodes and 17 season 1 episodes overall; Sulu was in 7 of the first 10 and 17 of the whole first season; and Uhura appeared or was heard over the intercom in every first-season episode except “Miri” and “The Devil in the Dark.”
In fact, the show lost recurring crew characters as it went rather than gaining them. In addition to Rand, there was also John Farrell, who was introduced in early season 1 as a recurring navigator but ultimately appeared in only three episodes before being dropped. Then there were a couple of characters added later in season 1 who didn’t last long — Kevin Riley was in two episodes and DeSalle was in three. The only later additions that ended up being permanently added to the main ensemble were Chapel and Chekov, along with some background players like Kyle and Leslie.
There’s the argument that TOS was conceived as an ensemble show and William Shatner wasn’t tuned into that and worked quite hard to get the limelight as Captain Kirk, although “that isn’t how acting works” crosses my mind. I think you only saw Spock as “the” star if you were fascinated by Leonard Nimoy, which I know is a thing. But like Seven of Nine, Spock is a differently-human character that you can tell different human stories with.
I suppose that “how Star Trek was conceived” is unusually on display in having two pilot episodes and then in committed fans having seen both of them. “The Cage” does have the captain’s job dissatisfaction as a big theme, so it looks like more of a Captain Pike biography, although I suppose that Pike’s series would also have many interesting alien encounters, space amoebas, gods, silicon rugs, and not be just about him.
@41/Robert Carnegie: “There’s the argument that TOS was conceived as an ensemble show and William Shatner wasn’t tuned into that and worked quite hard to get the limelight as Captain Kirk, although “that isn’t how acting works” crosses my mind.”
The intent was always to center the show primarily around the captain. Jeffrey Hunter was the only “regular” given main-title billing in “The Cage,” and Shatner was the only actor billed in the main titles to the original edit of the second pilot. And of course, Shatner and Nimoy were the only regulars billed in the first-season main titles. But a show could have a clear lead character yet still give its supporting cast a fair amount of attention and development. (For instance, The Time Tunnel focused primarily on Tony and Doug, but there was also plenty of attention devoted to General Kirk and his team back in the present.) Shatner did resist ceding the spotlight as Spock became the breakout star, but he was always meant to be more central than anyone else.
“I think you only saw Spock as “the” star if you were fascinated by Leonard Nimoy, which I know is a thing.”
Network executives are not guided by their own personal opinions, but by the audience’s response. Viewer fascination with Spock was indeed “a thing” — a huge thing, an almost Beatles-level mania, with Nimoy getting far more fan mail than the rest of the cast combined and being a media sensation far beyond the show itself. (It didn’t hurt that Nimoy was the only cast member to get Emmy nominations, once per season.) In response to that, NBC did indeed pressure Roddenberry to focus more on Spock, even to elevate him above Kirk as the central character, like how Dr. Smith took over Lost in Space or Fonzie later took over Happy Days. This was what Shatner fought against, and Roddenberry sided with him, wanting Kirk to remain in the central role. Reportedly, it was Roddenberry’s friend Isaac Asimov who gave him the solution to balancing the conflicting pressures: Emphasize the friendship between Kirk and Spock and make them inseparable. It allowed Kirk to remain central by riding Spock’s coattails, as it were.
@36: Seven wasn’t emphasized *solely* because of her sex appeal, but the sex appeal thing was certainly *part* of the reason for that emphasis, and something that was emphasized about her. You don’t need to look any further than how they costumed the character to see *that*.
Speaking of, the ‘We must have a woman in a onesie’ thing that ran through every iteration of Trek between TNG and ENT inclusive was really irritating. Like, even if you’re aiming for sex appeal… People look better in the uniforms.
Sirtis proved both back in the early ’90s for ‘modern’ Trek even if you decide to overlook Nichols back in the bleedin’ ’60s. On Voyager itself you have both Kate Mulgrew and Roxann Dawson. And of course later on in the series, Ryan herself would be in one — and prove it yet again, of course.
Also, in uniform, she probably would’ve been able to breathe.
@43/foamy: Yes, that is obvious, but life is not about either-or binaries. Something can be more than one thing at a time. What I resent is the tendency of so many people to assume that just because Seven was sexy, it meant that she had no other virtues warranting the show’s focus on her. That is sexist, wrong, and unfair to a compellingly written character and a brilliantly gifted performer.
As I said, Spock was a huge, huge sex symbol with female viewers back in the ’60s, but nobody ever assumed that the character and the actor had no other attributes, because our culture doesn’t question that an attractive man can have intelligence and talent. But if a woman happens to be desirable, especially if she’s a curvaceous blonde, our culture is predisposed to assume that she has no other virtues beyond her looks. It always made me furious to see that misogynistic assumption applied to Seven and Jeri Ryan, to see her brilliant performance dismissed because she happened to be wearing a catsuit. The catsuit didn’t benefit her, no, but fixating on it as the only subject of discussion does her just as great a disservice.
@38 / CLB:
I don’t see how it’s wrong or even particularly unusual to focus heavily on a new character in their early episodes. You need to establish who they are and how they relate to the other characters.
Right, it’s no different than how heavily featured Ezri Dax was in the final Season of DS9. They had to establish the new Dax host and differentiate her from Jadzia (and given they were also entering the series endgame, I can only imagine how stressed Behr and the Writers Room felt with this added hurdle).
So it’s no different that Seven would dominate much of VOY’s Season Four. But I think because of how she became the show’s breakout character, though, it’s easy to forget how necessary it was to establish her in those initial episodes.
It’s different from, say, adding Worf to the DS9 ensemble, because he was used to being a member of a Starfleet crew and following the chain of command.
Plus unlike Seven, Worf was also already a long-established character. The challenge there was integrating him (and by extension the Klingons) into the DS9 dynamic without losing what made Worf, heh, Worf.
@10: To be pedantic, it was Chakotay that tried to flush Seven into space. Janeway was unconscious in sickbay at the time.
@40: Maybe it’s my imagination, but it seems like the supporting characters are considered less essential in the first season than later on. You’ve got Lieutenant Hanson there in place of Sulu in “Court Martial” and “The Menagerie”, Farrell there in place of Uhura in “Miri”, Lieutenant Masters there in place of Scotty in “The Alternative Factor”. It feels like in later seasons, they were more likely to use the established character of there was a role for them rather than having someone who, especially in Hanson’s case, could be them simply by cutting and pasting the character’s name. I do acknowledge there are instances in later seasons but when you get a big run early on when Sulu and Scotty are absent (Sulu only appears in 8 of the first 15 episodes and Scotty only in 7), there’s a distinct feeling that they weren’t considered as essential back then as they did later. (I know Sulu misses a big chunk of Season 2 but that was down to external factors.)
@33:
Well the Ferengi had to come from somewhere after all and every creation reflects some aspect of their creator
Heh, but I thought they were supposed to evoke ‘Yankee Traders’. ;)
Incidentally, speaking of Ferengi and jokes, I’ve had oodles of fun using Ferengi references with my personal finances.
My Checking Account’s nickname was actually ‘Vault of Eternal Destitution’ at one point, LOL.
@46/cap: “Maybe it’s my imagination, but it seems like the supporting characters are considered less essential in the first season than later on. You’ve got Lieutenant Hanson there in place of Sulu in “Court Martial” and “The Menagerie”, Farrell there in place of Uhura in “Miri”, Lieutenant Masters there in place of Scotty in “The Alternative Factor”. It feels like in later seasons, they were more likely to use the established character of there was a role for them rather than having someone who, especially in Hanson’s case, could be them simply by cutting and pasting the character’s name.”
The supporting actors were only signed for a certain number of episodes per season, so yes, sometimes other actors took their place. But they were contracted for those episodes up-front, not on a week-by-week basis as you claimed. As I already told you, Uhura was in nearly every first-season episode, and both Scotty and Sulu were in 17 first-season episodes counting the second pilot, far more than any other guest actors. That’s nearly 60% of the season, easily enough to qualify as semi-regulars. It’s true that their contracts were expanded for seasons 2 & 3 (except for Sulu, because Takei missed much of the season while filming The Green Berets), but they absolutely were present as continuing ensemble players from the very beginning. And Rand would probably have been in as many episodes as McCoy if she hadn’t left the series so soon.
Also, Farrell was not a replacement for Uhura; he was conceived as a semi-regular navigator character, the spot that was eventually filled by Chekov, but the actor didn’t work out in the role. And Masters was certainly not “in place of Scotty”; she was intended to be the love interest for Lazarus, but that was written out of the script because it was too similar to Marla’s arc in “Space Seed.”
“there’s a distinct feeling that they weren’t considered as essential back then as they did later.”
You’re basing that on their number of appearances. I’m talking about the substance of their appearances, whether they actually got development as characters and story beats of their own and interplay with one another rather than just acknowledging orders and giving exposition and reacting to Kirk, Spock, and McCoy. I’m talking about the quality of the material they were given, not merely its quantity.
@48/CLB: I’m not saying they weren’t semi-regulars, I’m saying they were, as distinct from regular ensemble characters. They were never meant to be as prominent as Spock in the same way that, theoretically, Kim and Neelix were meant to be as prominent as Seven. And yes, I know Farrell’s primary role was as navigator, but that makes the fact that he’s suddenly working communications instead of Uhura even more blatant.
I do get what you’re saying, that as Spock became firmly established as the most popular character, the character work on the supporting cast got even less. I’m just not sure I entirely agree. Sure, there were episodes in later seasons where the supporting cast just got generic lines on the bridge, but that was true of the first season as well, and they still found time to give Sulu and Chekov’s perspective on things in episodes like “Amok Time” or “Turnabout Intruder”. It feels like they were just as likely to be let off the ship into the main action in later seasons as in the early episodes if not more so. George Takei has recalled how he successfully lobbied for Sulu to be given more focus in Season 2 only to find he wasn’t around to film it, resulting in his roles in episodes like “The Trouble With Tribbles” and “The Gamesters of Triskelion” being reassigned to Chekov.
I find Janeway’s deference to her ideals over solid tactics to protect her crew, annoying. Multiple times, especially in season four, we find Janeway making decisions that are needlessly perilous to her crew.
Protecting species 8472 is especially suspect. The particular being is part of an invasion force, guilty of war crimes, and likely already responsible for putting Voyager in peril in an earlier episode. This is not an innocent being, just trying to get home. Further, protecting species 8472 from the Hirogen, when the Hirogen is offering a pass to Voyager for merely not interfering in the hunt, is absurdly reckless to the lives of her crew and her ship, which is actually her first responsibility. Protecting species 8472 just isn’t the hill to die on and is a poor lesson in human compassion for Seven of Nine.
The investigation of the accused in the attack on Seven of Nine is also suspect. It’s clear that they are not going to get the hard evidence they desire to prosecute the arms dealer, but it’s also clear he is acting incredibly guilty. Janeway and others conjecture that Seven of Nine is having false memories that are related to her time with the Borg, but they provide no evidence of this, before dismissing her credibility as a witness, due to their lack of hard evidence. They begin to show regret/remorse for the guilty AF arms dealer, and eventually convince Seven of Nine that she imagined the entire attack, too. This is the absolute worst of victim shaming, all so that Janeway can uphold some high ideals about the burden of proof required to prosecute the arms dealer. Just because there isn’t enough evidence for a conviction doesn’t mean it’s ok to blame the victim.
@49/cap-mjb: “I’m not saying they weren’t semi-regulars, I’m saying they were, as distinct from regular ensemble characters. They were never meant to be as prominent as Spock in the same way that, theoretically, Kim and Neelix were meant to be as prominent as Seven.”
I never said they were meant to be as prominent. As I already clarified, I wasn’t comparing the show to modern ensemble casts, but to the supporting ensembles of ’60s shows. We’re talking past each other now.
What I was disputing was your incorrect claim that the supporting cast only gradually emerged over the first season. As I’ve shown, Scott, Sulu, Uhura, and Rand were heavily featured in the first ten episodes. The supporting ensemble did NOT evolve gradually but was established from the start. In fact, it was pretty stable as supporting ensembles go, with the only major changes over the run of the series being Rand’s early departure and Chekov’s later addition.
David: You’re jumping the gun a bit, but I agree with you w/r/t “Retrospect.” The rewatch for that episode will go up later today.
—Keith R.A. DeCandido
What bothered me most about this episode was the way Janeway tried to persuade Seven to help the 8472. It was clearly emotionally manipulative. First trying the inspiring real-life story of Young Janeway, and then when that didn’t work, full-on ordering her to do it, and then when that didn’t work she punished her. I was reminded of the TNG episode The Enemy when Worf is the only crew member who can save a critically injured Romulan. Picard asks him to reconsider his firm stance against donating what the Romulan needs. When Worf refuses again, Picard does not order him to comply, despite the fact that the Romulan’s death will certainly put the Enterprise in danger. Picard simply respected his crew member’s feelings over anything else. I found Janeway’s conduct distasteful, making her severe reaction to Seven’s actions later even more problematic to me. Janeway created this problem unnecessarily.
Sunday morning and here they are rerunning the episodes that were on daily during the week (This episode is still on as I type this)
Having watched the Janeway / Seven interaction I must agree with Eduardo Jencarelli in post 13. The “go to your room” phrase is the one that immediately sprang to mind and Janeway was dealing with someone who’s development had yet to fully even start to develop – not since being liberated from the collective – but since she had been assimilated a couple of decades previously.
I don’t know whether this aspect is heightened by the fact that I am watching this straight after the previous episode where the J/7 interaction was around Seven possibly having family on Earth and 7 saying that she had no real emotion relating to the letters being received and she had no emotional connection to Earth.
This showed how the creation of a fully rounded emotional being had been aborted, and framed the encounter in the next episode, to me, in a starker manner.
If Species 8472 are impervious to sensors, why can a tricorder scan bring up information about them? And how can it be beamed off the ship as well since it would probably confuse the targeting scanners? Janeway must relate to the alien’s desire to get home. It’s no wonder Torres has no luck opening a singularity with Voyager’s engines since they’re not opened that way. I don’t think the crew had any plans to revisit fluidic space any time soon and that’s why Seven never shared that knowledge with anyone.
Janeway’s enforcement of the chain of command is rather inconsistent, and inconsistency is a major gripe fans have with VGR. I liked the fact that whether the Hirogen or Species 8472 emerged the victor is left ambiguous. Clint Carmichael also played the Hirogen Janeway talks to on the viewscreen. I thought Scotty’s solution was nasty considering how much Klingons despise tribbles. I’m sure whoever falls on the side of Janeway or Seven at the end of Prey will lead to a polarising argument since Seven is not an actual Starfleet officer.
1: Tony Todd did have to wear older makeup in The Visitor but he never allows prosthetics to bury him (the fact he has such a great voice helps immeasurably). Back in the early days of TNG, Gene Roddenberry was very against conflict of any kind among the crew because in his mind, humanity had evolved beyond that. But with his failing health and the inclusion of greats like Rick Berman and Ronald D. Moore to the staff, TNG as well as DS9 began to incorporate more conflict and as a result, grew into something much better. Sadly, VGR never fully learned that lesson.
2: Janeway’s “as you were” is just another way of saying “go back to sleep Borg Queen”. (I also like the fact that Seven was regenerating when Janeway came in, seemingly thinking the matter is closed when really it’s only just begun). 3: If the Hirogen knew Seven and Tuvok were took “in a fair hunt” in the previous episode, would they have tried that much harder to reclaim their relics instead of letting them go? The Hirogen arc is treated much better than the Jonas one, which I’ve always felt is because it had a proper beginning, middle and an end. We had to wait for Prey to see what the Hirogen looked like, didn’t we?
4: It made the cast begin to lose interest as well. 10: How exactly does the Cardassian war fit into the overall Trek chronology? I’ve always been curious about that. 11: I don’t know if the Hirogen hunt one another but they will kill them if they don’t agree with their decisions (as we’ll see in The Killing Game).
12: I’ve liked some of Trek’s less conventional endings like Conspiracy or Distant Origin where they just don’t go on they’re merry way. By the time of Retrospect, everything isn’t back to normal. Janeway’s prepared to give Seven some leeway, but only in small doses; Seven will have to do a bit more before Janeway lets her off that short leash (something Chakotay reminds her of). And the Doctor calls her charming while Seven calls him lovely!
13: The Trek shows usually find their footing round about the 2-3yr mark; VGR’s fourth season is more sure footed than the last three but it’s still a terribly inconsistent series. You’re right that the relationship between Janeway and Seven is like that of a mother and her teenage daughter (Janeway all but grounds Seven at the end!). Trek has a tendency to wimpify it’s enemies, and it happened to Species 8472 much sooner than I feared. Seven shocked Idrin in Message in a Bottle, not Hunters.
16: I thought the writers made an effort to flesh out the Romulans, but the Orion Syndicate were singularly ruthless. 18: Janeway did turn around when she delivered “as you were”, not from her departing back. Seven tackled the situation with typical Borg thinking, which is just not the Starfleet way. 19: Chakotay’s importance will lessen over the next couple of years. 20: At least Tom’s confinement isn’t some dank hole in the ground like something from The Shawshank Redemption.
21: You’re right CLB, it’s hard to develop characters who are boring or lacking in much dimension. 22: “Yeoman work?” 24: I think they were afraid to return to the Andorians because of those damn antennas. 25: I always thought Peak Performance was a rather undervalued Ferengi episode (even if it doesn’t become one until the last act). 26: I think The Nagus was the first truly great Ferengi episode on DS9.
36: Is it true that Shatner and Nimoy resented one another because of either’s position in the eyes of fandom? 38: When Michael Dorn first joined DS9, he didn’t get any singular episodes between The Way of the Warrior and The Sword of Kahless because Worf’s decision to join the series was retconned much later on but there was a similar heavy focus on Ezri Dax in S7, just like Jeri Ryan. 43: Jeri Ryan did pass out in the silver catsuit if she turned her head too sharply, and that’s why the later catsuits are noticeably lesser around the neckline.
46: And Janeway wasn’t happy about Chakotay flagrantly defying her authority in the same way she reacted to Seven’s. 49: All the Trek shows get more generic lines in their first seasons. 50: It’s strange to see Janeway so protective of Species 8472 compared with Scorpion where she struggled to justify her plan to Chakotay (something he called her out on). That could be chalked up to inconsistency in the writing. I’d also like to know how the alien found itself relative to Voyager’s position, when the war they fought was over 10,000 light-years distant.
54: I liked Seven’s development over the next four years, the way Ryan gradually peels back the layers of Seven’s Borg cocoon (I attest that to Ryan’s exceptional acting chops rather than anything on the writers part).
Is Seven of Nine a part of Voyager’s hierarchy? From my perspective, she’s like Neelix and Kes were – passengers who were helping out, but not part of Starfleet, no ranks etc, so not part of the hierarchy. Which makes it even more questionable based on what she was trying to order her around in this episode. I would accept her authority over Seven the same way as any ship captain has over the passengers – there are definitely things that the captain can order them to do if necessary (especially related to the safety of everyone on board or keeping some sort of law followed etc), but i believe that authority has limits. So for me it was perfectly normal that they have accepted Nine’s behaviour (e.g. when she summons Janeway and Chakotay to astrometrics etc.).
Also, I did not see any brilliant ideas from the rest of the crew (including Janeway) how they would want to resolve the situation (nor do i understand why the waited for the hirogen ships instead of, you know, going to warp?), so Seven acted quite logically to me (even though i morally disagree with her decision).
Last, but not least, the whole 8472 vs Hirogens seemed to be an Aliens vs Predators episode in ST universe. :)