Happy Monday, Sanderfans and Cosmere Chickens! And welcome back to our read-along discussion of the preview chapters of Wind and Truth. This week’s preview features chapters 5 and 6. We really hope you’re enjoying the preview chapters so far, because we’re enjoying discussing them with you and seeing all of your thoughts and theories. Keep them coming so that we can quote you in future articles!
Remember that these read-along discussions will likely contain full Cosmere spoilers, especially as Drew deep dives into invested thoughts and theories. So beware, if you have yet to catch up on all the goings on in the Cosmere!
Let’s get to it!
Paige’s Summary and Commentary
Chapter five is titled “What Might Still Be” and the epigraph is very interesting:
As a historian, I find such nuances relevant. As a philosopher, I find them enticing.
I’ve seen a lot of speculation that either Kaladin or Szeth is writing/has written the in-world book, Knights of Wind and Truth, but neither is a historian nor a philosopher. At least, not in the present time. So perhaps the speculation will branch out to include other possible characters. At this point, I’m thinking Jasnah, as she fits that description better than anyone else in the book. Or possibly Sigzil? Once again, I should note we did not get epigraphs during the beta read so these are all new for us, too, and I’m guessing here as much as anyone else.
Moving on… we’re with Shallan again in this chapter, drawing as she sits in the open-air forum where Adolin’s trial took place. She notices that she’s absently sketched a face in her current project, a feminine singer face that she doesn’t remember drawing—something that has happened on previous occasions, namely in The Way of Kings and in Oathbringer. She flips back through her book to find that she’s done this repeatedly and thinks about how the Unmade that was in Urithiru caused her drawings to be skewed. This, of course, makes her wonder momentarily if there might be an Unmade about.
Dismissing her thoughts, she looks toward Adolin, who is with Godeke the Edgedancer as well as Shallan’s Lightweavers and their spren. They’re waiting for honorspren who are willing to bond squires and they’re disappointed when only twelve show up. TWELVE. Seems a rather paltry turnout considering how much Adolin went through in his trial.
Notum then enters and sits with Shallan. They discuss the honorspren that showed up, and Notum is more optimistic about it than Shallan, who lets Radiant take the fore (or take control of the wagon, I suppose) for their conversation. Notum states that he will join the honorspren in the Physical Realm but that he won’t bond. Other honorspren pass, but they’re not going to join the Radiants; instead, they’re leaving Lasting Integrity to make their own way. So they’re dissenters from the bulk of the honorspren in the fortress, but not so much that they’d be willing to bond a human. I, like Shallan, am disappointed. Somebody better cough up some boots for me.
After Notum leaves, Kelek arrives to break the news that he won’t be joining them to go to Urithiru. Shallan tells him he’s not safe in Lasting Integrity but he says he’ll hide, and that he needs to keep the seon, who can’t travel just yet. Shallan begins to draw him and he tells her the Heralds are broken but dismisses her when she replies that she knows how that feels. No, Kelek… she really knows how that feels! He asks if she’s really going to search for Mishram and of course, she will do just that. He says that Ishar believes that all of the Unmade should be contained, and that he’s afraid of what she’ll do if released from her prison because she hates humans.
When Shallan shows him the finished drawing, he asks if she often draws upon Fortune. She doesn’t know what he means, but he continues, theorizing that her two bonds might have something to do with it and asked how often she looks into the Spiritual Realm and manifests it in her art. He suggests that she’s been thinking a lot about Ba-Ado-Mishram… which is probably why she’s been drawing Mishram’s face over and over (so at least Shallan now knows the identity of the mysterious singer). Which is super creepy, once you think about it. It’s fascinating to know that Shallan is able to see into the Spiritual Realm sometimes while drawing and, as Kelek says, “glimpse someone’s possible selves.”
Then the Windrunners arrive to escort them back to Urithiru. Only five show up, and Shallan thinks of how Adolin might react to the fact that he’ll have to leave Gallant and his swords behind in Shadesmar when he jogs up the steps… and immediately asks how many of them it would take to fly his horse home. Oh, Adolin… you really are the best boy.
Chapter six is titled “Nobility” and has a slightly longer epigraph. I won’t quote it here because Lyndsey talks about it below, but it might have ruined my brand-new theory that Jasnah may have written the in-world book since she is a Radiant and it seems that at the writing of Knights of Wind and Truth the Heralds have disappeared! What the what? Where would they/could they have gone, and why? Perhaps the Oathpact was restored and they returned to Braize? For the sake of their already broken minds, I truly hope not!
Kaladin meets with Dalinar. They discuss Kaladin’s mission to try to treat Ishar’s mental illness, and Dalinar announces that he’s sending Szeth to accompany Kaladin. Szeth says he’s returning to his homeland “to set right what is wrong” and to achieve the Fourth Ideal. Kaladin pushes back against this idea, arguing that Szeth isn’t stable, then realizes that Dalinar expects him to help Szeth with his mental state during their journey, as well.
Dalinar suggests they speak privately so they head to the roof of Urithiru where he speaks frankly about the contest of champions and how he doesn’t know what to expect. Neither does the fandom, who are frothing at the mouth to know what will happen and how the contest will be fought. Dalinar then asks Kaladin to fly him to a peak higher up in the mountains; he wants to see all of Urithiru.
They talk more of Szeth and Kaladin basically says he can’t help Szeth until Dalinar explains why he feels it’s important to try to help Szeth and others, rather than abandoning them. Kaladin promises that he’ll try, and mentions that Wit told him that he wouldn’t make it back before the contest, so Dalinar says they’ll send a spanreed with Szeth. He also stresses that he needs someone dealing with the situation in Shinovar who will have his back because Ishar is dangerous. Dangerous, you say, Dalinar? Whatever gave you that impression? ::side eye::
Dalinar has one more piece of business to discuss with Kaladin before they head back to the tower. Since neither of his sons is interested in ruling Urithiru once Dalinar and Navani are gone, whenever that might be… Dalinar wants Kaladin to be his heir. Kaladin is more than a little freaked out by this, and extremely reluctant about taking on such a weighty task. Dalinar asks him to please take some time to consider it and, Kaladin being Kaladin, he agrees to think it over.
So, what do you think of these chapters, Sanderfans? Do you think Shallan will somehow get into the Spiritual Realm to find Mishram? If so, how? We know precious little about the Spiritual Realm (at least I do!) but other than Dalinar uniting the realms to create Honor’s Perpendicularity, I don’t know how anyone would access it. Interesting to think about, though!
What about Kaladin? How will he and Szeth get along on their trip? What does Szeth “cleansing” Shinovar actually mean? Will Kaladin actually be able to help Szeth improve his mental state or is our assassin too far gone at this point? And… will Kaladin accept Dalinar’s offer of becoming the heir to Urithiru?
So much to discuss this week! Let us know your thoughts in the comments!
Lyndsey’s Commentary: Characters and Relationships
Chapter five has Shalash (Ash), Herald of Beauty and the Lightweavers, in all four spots. Her aspects are Creative/Honest, and her role is Artist.
It’s quite fitting that Ash is our Herald of this chapter, since it’s a Shallan POV and she’s doing a lot of drawing. She’s also being very honest with Kelek and Notum, and vice versa. A fitting choice.
Our herald of chapter six is Ishi (Ishar), Herald of Luck and the Bondsmiths. His aspects are Pious/Guiding and his role is Priest. This chapter mainly has to do with Dalinar sending Kaladin off to help this particular Herald, so an actual physical representation of him does make sense. However, there’s also the Guiding aspect—not only is Dalinar providing guidance for Kaladin, but he’s asking Kaladin to do the same for Szeth.
As a historian, I find such nuances relevant. As a philosopher, I find them enticing.
—From Knights of Wind and Truth, page 4
A historian and philosopher?! Well, that shoots most of my theories out of the water as to the identity of our mystery author! Kal’s many things, but historian and philosopher don’t top the list.
Regardless, the events surrounding the cleansing of Shinovar are of specific relevance, and I am doing my best to record what I can discover of the Wind’s own words regarding them. Though, now that the Wind and Heralds have vanished, I have only two sources who can speak of these events.
They are my witnesses.
—From Knights of Wind and Truth, page 5
Okay, well… that answers some questions and brings up a TON more. We can pretty safely assume that Kal and Szeth are the two sources, considering the fact that we are seeing them be sent off together to Shinovar, and Kal’s been hearing the Wind. Unless maybe the Wind has been speaking to others as well? (At least if the two sources are Kal and Szeth, that’s implicit confirmation that they survive the cleansing of Shinovar!)
But what’s this about the Wind and Heralds vanishing?
Notum
“There is nothing more for me here,” Notum said. “I have been rejected of mine, and have seen their pettiness. I should like to be of service. Though… I admit, I do not wish to bond a human. I loathe the idea. Is that petty of me, in turn?”
Lots of betrayal going on in this chapter. Notum’s dealing with his fears of betrayal based on the humans’ past actions, and wondering whether he can trust them again—and given their treatment of… well, almost everyone, who can blame him? They enslaved the parshmen. They imprisoned Mishram. They stole this world from the Indigenous people to begin with… There’s a lot of history to unpack here for the Honorspren who need to decide whether to join them. A lot of trust that needs to be earned back from the other side. Will they succeed in that?
Kelek
“We are broken, Shallan,” Kelek finally said. “We are not the heroes you wish us to be. Not anymore.”
This comment feels portentous. The question is, which possibile future is it foreshadowing? The fact that the Heralds are going to overcome their mental setbacks and step back up to be heroes again? Or that others will take their places, and become heroes in their steads? We’re already seeing a new generation of heroes in the Radiants. Are those Radiants going to have to fill the gap that the Heralds have left?
Mishram
“Ishar says all the Unmade should be contained, yet what we did to the singers by imprisoning her…”
If what Kelek is saying about imprisoning her in a gem for thousands of years is true, I wouldn’t blame Mishram for turning on the humans and joining the singers. Especially since she seems to have some connection (or Connection?) to them to begin with.
Shallan
There’s some beautiful commentary about the creation of art in this chapter, and how it relates to Shallan’s state of mind. It’s great to see her drawing again, and doing her “Fortune” drawings, as Kelek calls it. Her ability to see the best in others, to see the potential of who they could be, is one of the most fascinating things about her character. I think it stems from her own fragmented nature. She’s had to think and act as so many other people that she’s able to think outside of the box and understand others’ perspectives; she has a capacity for empathy which extends further than a normal person’s.
Kaladin
You asked me to be a surgeon, not a soldier. I’m game.”
A surgeon for the mind—who didn’t cut with a scalpel, but with calm words and understanding.
I’m so here for Therapist!Kal. He was already heading in this direction, of course, but it’s nice to see the momentum continue. And it’s also incredibly rare, in the grand scheme of fantasy protagonists, to see a hero go from “badass warrior wielding a spear and crazy awesome powers” to “gentle-hearted therapist trying to fix people rather than kill them.” You’d expect to see the opposite progression, so it’s nice that Sanderson subverted that expectation.
The Alethi parshmen had been enslaved too, but had taken their homeland for themselves. In other circumstances, he would have cheered their fight—he knew precisely what it was like to have your dignity stripped away, to be beaten until you lost personality and volition, becoming a thing.
This is one of the things I find most fascinating about his character, and about the totality of Stormlight. While it’s nice sometimes to have a clear Evil to root against like in Lord of the Rings, this world of morally grey choices and no clear “right” answer is more true to real life, and the choices we all have to face on a day-to-day basis.
Who was Kaladin to do this?
The only person available. Stormfather help them all.
I can think of no one better qualified—but of course Kaladin wouldn’t see himself that way.
Dalinar’s offer to make him the heir of Urithiru highlights another facet of his personality which we didn’t see too often in Rhythm of War: his hatred of the nobility, and now this is manifesting in a bit of self-loathing for Kal. Here’s another thing he needs to come to terms with in order to grow.
Szeth
To achieve the Fourth Ideal, a Skybreaker must undertake a crusade of righteous cause. Upon completing it, I will be poised for the final step, in which a man becomes the law itself.
I am so stoked to find out more about Szeth’s backstory. I’ve always been a sucker for a tortured antihero with a killer heel-face turn. Szeth is so deliciously complicated in his motivations and morals, and the prospect of learning what makes him tick—FINALLY—is practically making me salivate.
Dalinar
“We’ve been fighting the singers since our first generations on this planet […]. I want to see that cycle ended.”
I love Dalinar’s transition from hardened, heartless warlord to pacifist over the course of his life. It’s such a powerful transition, and a beautiful one, when you think about it. He’s learned the value of human (and singer) life, and doesn’t want to take it anymore. If only his brother could have learned the same lessons…
Wit/Hoid
“Best speak to Midius—your Wit—about that. A fantodic man himself, that one.”
Wait. Did we just casually get Hoid’s real name dropped on us?! (And on that fitting note, I turn this discussion over to Drew.)
Drew’s Commentary: Invested Arts and Theories
All right. I haven’t addressed it yet, and I know it’s been touched on briefly by Lyn and Paige above, but we have to talk about the epigraphs.
The vast majority of the Knights of Wind and Truth speculation so far has been aimed at Szeth and Kaladin—which is understandable, given the name of the in-world book. Kaladin is right there for Wind, especially given the new voice whispering in his ear, and Szeth is the Truthless on a quest to right the wrongs of his past. If anyone is going to be aligned with Truth as a title, it’ll be him, right?
But neither Kaladin nor Szeth fits the mold as a philosopher or historian. On top of that, the epigraph for chapter 6 feeds out an enticing bit of context: There are two witnesses for the author to draw information from. Szeth and Kaladin sure feel like the right choices, which would preclude both of them from being the author.
I have to admit, this is fun speculation for me. As Paige said, we didn’t get the epigraphs in the beta draft. I’m totally in the dark here, and it’s opening up a new reading experience as I go through Wind and Truth in its final form right alongside all of you.
For the record, I think there are some fascinating options for the author of Knights of Wind and Truth, given these new epigraphs. Jasnah certainly fits, and this reminds me of the preview chapters for Oathbringer. There was a great deal of speculation that she was the voice behind that in-world book, before Dalinar’s backstory came to light. It would be both funny and totally on-brand for Brandon to hit us with a Jasnah-authored book after so much of the fandom spent energy guessing that she wrote Oathbringer.
The other possibility I find most engaging is Renarin. He’s a Knight Radiant himself, but of a very different sort. He’s still hanging around Kaladin and the Windrunners, though, thanks to his connection to Bridge Four. I could see him having a sort of removed focus—perhaps even envy—on the Windrunners. It would make sense for him to have the interest necessary to follow in his father’s footsteps and create a record of Kaladin and Szeth heading off to Shinovar.
But before I get too far into the weeds on the epigraphs, I want to bring up one of the more obscure—in a couple different ways—elements of The Stormlight Archive. Way back in The Way of Kings, we got a typically enigmatic Death Rattle:
He must pick it up, the fallen title! The tower, the crown, and the spear!
And what do we see at the very start of chapter six? Kaladin approaches Dalinar, noting his “Kholin blue uniform with his glyphs on the back: the tower and the crown.”
So the Tower and the Crown are obvious signifiers for House Kholin and Dalinar in particular, but in this chapter we’ve been given a straight connection to Kaladin as well, as the potential heir to Urithiru. And if any character in the series can be symbolized by a spear, it’s Kaladin.
However, Kaladin steps right up to the moment and rejects Dalinar’s request. He’s persuaded to reconsider his definitive negative answer, promising to think more about it, but he’s also going to have a great deal more on his mind in just a couple hours, as he catches a highstorm and jets off to Shinovar to try inventing therapy with Szeth.
This feels like a classic Brandon foreshadowing moment, but the further we get into the Cosmere, the more we have to wonder about the layers spread before us.
Fan Theories
We love hearing your thoughts and theories as these preview chapters are being released and the discussions continue. Here are some notable comments on the Wind from last week’s chapters:
From the preview of Chapters 3 and 4, Forgetable said, “Is the Wind mishram? It’s a direct spawn of adonalsium but I forget the unmade lore, haven’t done my reread yet.” And their speculation that the Wind is Mishram isn’t the only such speculation I’ve seen. Our own Drew McCaffrey has wondered the very same thing, as has kevbot68 on Reactor, who commented, “Yeah, the wind is definitely Mishram.”
Over on Reddit, sent_16 writes “my personal theory (it probably doesn’t make sense) is that kaladin is the wind, he ascends then gets trapped in the spiritual realm somehow, and talks to himself in the past.” But sacae- says, “If the Wind is part of what Old Magic may have been before being more associated with Nightwatcher and Cultivation… I do wonder if there’s some link still. More so because the Wind could finally talk after Tav ascended with vessel change. What if her plan in having him take the vessel was more to free the Wind more than replacing Odium?” Moist-Exchange2890 chimed in with: “Okay, I’m almost positive the wind will become a bondsmith Spren and Kal will bond it.“
Back in the Reactor comments, CremlingCrimes quoted Wit saying, “I don’t know what to do or who to pray to, since the only true God I’ve known is the one we rejected and killed. So I’m sending you off, Kaladin. Hoping that if the Wind spoke to you, then some piece of that ancient deity is watching.” and then went on to comment, “So is the Wind a part of this true God? Also interesting that when Hoid refers to the Wind it’s capitalized but when Kaladin speaks of it it’s without capitalization.” Bao seems to agree, saying, “The wind sounds like a deity that isn’t one of the 16 shards, maybe a spren of Adonalsium or something like that.” Could the Wind be a part of (a spren of?) Adonalsium, Sanderfans? What do you think about that? And while we did notice that Kaladin calls it the “wind” while Wit calls it the “Wind,” we don’t know at this point whether that’s significant.
On the 17th Shard Discord, discussion of the contest of champions has been rampant. Toby says “My guess is they’ll somehow rebuild Honor.” Toby focused on the information we know from Sel and the Dor, adding “We know that Investiture tries to be sapient.”
But Timo worries about that possibility, saying “I kinda hope we aren’t getting another ending where someone picks up a Shard and becomes a god. It was cool in Mistborn, but a 2nd time would kinda lose impact.”
Dalinar’s worries over his role as arbiter seem to reflect that possibility. What would happen if Dalinar did end up rebuilding Honor and using that power to defeat Odium (even temporarily)?
We’ll be keeping an eye on the comment sections of posts about this article on various social media platforms and may include some of your comments/speculation (with attribution) on future weeks’ articles! Keep the conversation going, and PLEASE remember to spoiler-tag your comments on social media to help preserve the surprise for those who choose to wait for the full release. See you next Monday with chapters seven through nine!
Paige said “it seems that at the writing of Knights of Wind and Truth the Radiants have disappeared! What the what? Where would they/could they have gone, and why?” but the epigraph says that the HERALDS disappeared, not Radiants. I think the difference is important. Not that it has to be Jasnah or a Radiant, but it can still be :)
I’m hoping Notum bonds Rlain at some point.
Lyndsey said “I can think of no one better qualified—but of course Kaladin wouldn’t see himself that way.” and I completely agree <3
I can’t wait to learn more of Szeth and his background.
Between Drew and a comment I saw on Reddit, I really like the speculation that this chapter 6 aligns with the death rattle from TWOK, and that Kaladin is going to HAVE to pick up the fallen title…but that would also mean Dalinar definitely dies which I would not enjoy.
Yeah, that was incorrect… it said the Heralds disappeared. As this is my first time seeing the epigraphs, I am now aware I need to proofread better!
Regarding Rlain, if you recall, he bonded one of Sja-Anat’s spren at the end of RoW, and is now a Truthwatcher.
Dalinar AND Navani would have to die for Kaladin to be forced to pick up the title, which leaves me more than a little terrified for this book. It means no Bondsmiths, Stormfather and Sibling once again severed from Bonds…
The Epigraph says that the Wind is gone, which is a piece of Adonalsium according to Wit… so terrifying.
Lyndsey asked if we just found out Hoid’s real name: 1 – I don’t think so given non-canon writings we have, but also 2 – we’ve seen this name before at the end of Oathbringer when Ash comments on the drawings of her and Taln, saying it was “Midius’ drawing style”
Given the seeming importance of Sigzil in later Stormlight and Cosmere, I’m going to go out on a limb for now and say he is in-World Author
I’m also curious when it is written, since it said the Heralds were gone, but we know that Heralds will be back-half Stormlight flashback characters at least.
Regarding the author of the in-world book, Sig is also one of my options, the other being Jasnah.
@sw_pants. Rlain is already bonded to Tumi. I think Notum will bond a singer. It would be great if he bonded Leshwi.
I agree, Notum should bond a singer, and Leshwi would be pretty fitting. She seems like she deserves a redemption arc.
Yeah I was like ?? Heralds disappeared, not radiants. Which kind of works, during the timeskip they’re missing so they can’t help in the interim, sucks to lose the wind right after discovering it.
Rlain already bonded a corrupted truthspren like Renarin? So won’t be him bonding Notum..
I think odium/teravangian will cite Dallinar swearing an oath to the stormfather that his soul belongs to Nevani during their wedding as president that Dalinar (and Nevani since she swore the same oath) cannot give up their soul to satisfy the terms of their final contract, passing the responsibility to their next in line which will now be Kaladin. I believe that hell be the one to make the choice of whether to “kill the child and give them time to breathe”.
I think he’ll solve the problem by swearing the fifth ideal and allowing Ishar or Dalinar to reforge the oathpact, which will release the previous Heralds (why they are no longer available as I think this will kill them) and and require new heralds to take their place, one for each order (I think Kaladin will replace Jezrien) and they will be transported to braize. This would ironically fit with the opening chapter where Gavilar desired becoming a herald but would have been horrible at it, now others will achieve his dream but with a better understanding of the sacrifice that they are making.
I think odium/teravangian will cite Dallinar swearing an oath to the stormfather that his soul belongs to Nevani during their wedding as president that Dalinar (and Nevani since she swore the same oath) cannot give up their soul to satisfy the terms of their final contract,
didn’t the simpsons use this same argument 30 years ago when homer sold his soul to the devil?
See we’ve been theorizing about this for a decade but it’s just..a BAD solution. The oathpact didn’t work. Unless you swap out heralds each desolation it just isn’t tenable. I think it’s got to be something else.
I absolutely love the idea of King Kal, holding the tower during the timeskip, and remaining a figure in the back 5 books. But Navani needs to be okay so the sibling keeps working, we only just got it.
Yeah idk it’s hard to say if we’ll go into the timeskip with everything bleak or a hopeful pause.. As Brandon said it’s just like the and of an anime arc, not an ending
Dalinar becoming a fused terrorizing the cosmere would be insane but I really don’t want him to end up like that haha
I think since the Heralds vanished..they wanted to make amends for abandoning Taln, Kaladin realized going back to Braize and facing the torture would cure them and they accept, a tenuous restoration of the oathpact during the timeskip, this time leaving Taln on Roshar, being replaced by someone, along with jezrien..I think that makes the most sense, gives them an honorable way to make amends..and is more of a temporary solution, while they figure out a permanent one. I just can’t wait for the first encounter between Dalinar and tOdium haha
The problem is, the Fused now have the means to irrevocably kill the Heralds. So they won’t be facing torture. And while in principle it would make sense for them to buy a respite for Roshar by their final deaths and it would fit the 10+ year gap between arcs…. I really dislike how little we have seen of the female Heralds so far and how peripheral they have been.
The men have been responsible for a number of things, both great and terrible, both before and after they had abandoned their charge. In some countries Jezrien and Kelek were worshipped as god’s, instead of Honor. Ishar has been behind so many events and decisions that had shaped the destiny of Roshar and is clearly going to be very active in WaT. Taln held back the Desolations by himself for 4.5 millenia. Etc. But the women were just… there and so far seem to have been thoroughly side-lined.
And of course they haven’t done anything of note during the time of the series proper either. And no, I don’t count the whole Chana Davar stuff, even if it turns out to be true. Or Ash destroying her depictions. Or Battar(?) riding Taravangian’s coat-tails off-screen.
So, the female Heralds should better not be dead just yet, and hopefully get plenty to do in the second arc.
I’ve also been disappointed to not have seen much of the female Heralds. Well, really nothing on screen but Ash. So I hope we get to finally see them!
For what it’s worth – we’ve known Midius to be one of Hoid’s aliases for a while now, it popped up in Kelek’s diary epigraphs in RoW (advising them to store their memories in Breaths), which is why I remembered it because I just read that yesterday.
Coppermind also has it in Chapter 121 of Oathbringer, which I don’t remember the context of – it’s the chapter where Jez gets killed (and f*&# be upon Moash for all eternity). Maybe I’ll go and look it up.
I’m pretty sure there is an Ash viewpoint where she is talking to Taln, and mentions that she saw drawings with their accurate likenesses represented, so she suspects Midius is up to his old tricks. Earlier in the book, it was mentioned that Hoid had made drawings of the Heralds. The two separate instances give Midius as Hoid’s name when taken together.
There’s a lot of theorizing about how to ‘get into’ the Spiritual Realm to find Mishram. What if Mishram isn’t in the Spiritual Realm, but the path to Mishram can only be found in the Spiritual Realm. Shallan’s ability to peek into the Spiritual Realm through her drawing could give her the ability to find that path to Ba-Ado-Mishram. On the other hand, this same ability to draw herself into physical space, i.e. drawing stone all around her so she can hide, could also allow her to draw herself into the location of Ba-Ado-Mishram within the Spiritual Realm, i.e. draw the SR all around herself so she can pluck the gem. What do you think?
P.S. I don’t understand what/who Fortune is….
This is what I found about Fortune, from the Coppermind.
https://coppermind.net/wiki/Fortune
(No story spoilers whatsoever but I refer to the Mistborn Ars Arcanum so be aware of that)
Fortune is one of those rather squishy concepts that haven‘t been fully defined yet, I think – it pops up in the Mistborn Ars Arcanum as something certain Ferrings can store, and it sounds like it‘s about how lucky you are (as in, succeeding at tasks that are dependent on random chance). Here, it seems to be related to the destiny of a person – there are a number of paths open to you in your life, and you „make your fortune“ by going down one of them. Shallan‘s skill, as explained by Kelek, is to sort of pluck one of those paths out and show to you how it would look if you went down it. But yeah, it‘s very vague.
ROdium commented to Taravangian how impressive it was to have completed the Diagram without access to Fortune (and then proceeds to show off with what he can see via his access to Fortune … that in turn goes on to give Taravangian the clue that Odium cannot see near Renarin Kholin).
I feel like there is a lot of misdirection in these chapters, by Brandon.
We of course are spending so much time each week dissecting every paragraph that we perhaps are seeing what seems like a lot of theories we have held for years might be coming to pass.
I am sure, some of those will occur.
But if we had just picked up the book and started reading it from cover-to-cover, would we be clinging on the same things?
These are essentially set-up chapters and info dumps for what is to come.
Now I am not suggesting Brandon is toying with us, giving us false breadcrumbs on purpose because these were going to be pre-prelease chapters, But I still feel there is a lot of misdirection in what has been presented (and over analyzed) and where the story is going.
I think I will enjoy coming back to the comments from these first few chapters, once done reading the whole book, and see if what I (and others) have posted / theorized come true.
Yeah, I kind of wish that we would go back and cover these preview chapters in the re-read so we can go chapter-by-chapter and discuss how wrong we were once we have the full context of the book to work with.
I was also thinking Jasnah or Renarin make sense as the authors. Has anyone considered it might be a spren though? I can almost make a case for it being Syl, especially given how human-like she is becoming with each subsequent chapter! And if Kaladin takes the deal with Dalinar and they both perish, could she become the ruler of Urithiru in the end? This would all depend on her surviving and becoming more studious as she progresses.
I also check in coppermind and discover Jochi, one character that can be consider philosopher or a historical scholar, and there is no much info about him/her…. Sanderson has been playing with us with the idea of Kaladin, and Szeth and perhaps now he can try to confuse us with Jasnah or Renarin..
Will y’all wondeful folks keep posting articles like “everything we know about Worldhoppers” like reactor did before RoW?
Drew updated the Worldhoppers article: https://reactormag.com/everything-we-know-about-worldhoppers-going-into-wind-and-truth/
As for anything else, we’re still waiting to know what might come out and when.
I’m trying to find this out for you… I’ll try to remember to touch base here when I get an answer.
Drew posted https://reactormag.com/everything-we-know-about-worldhoppers-going-into-wind-and-truth/ on August 8th … I think it could be helpful to do another series like that (secret societies, etc.).
What haha? The epigraph says wind and heralds have disappeared, not radiants. I definitely think the night of Sorrows will be another event and possibly lose access to Stormlight but yeah, doesn’t say anything about radiants there, still could be Jasnah. Sigzil goes offworld in this book so won’t be him. Not Navani since she did RoW..idk unlike oathbringer and RoW it isn’t immediately obvious who’s writing it
Yes, that’s been pointed out. We’re working on a correction.
Anyone else got a feeling that the deed has 3 glyphs on them:
“He must pick it up, the fallen title! The tower, the crown, and the spear!”
I think the only title Kaladin is picking up at the end of the book is Herald, replacing Jezrien. Originally I thought he would go to Braise alone but now I feel all the surviving heralds will go too. Hence them disappearing.
Is it possible Syl is the Wind and is just now starting to remember?
The Wind spoke to Kaladin with Syl sitting next to him, so I doubt it’s her.
Midius is just another pseudonym, the one he used back in the day with the Heralds, like Cephandrius or Topaz. Unfortunately still not his real name haha
hard to say…in the (unpublished and unfinished) “liar of partinel”, midius (our hoid) was an apprentice to…”hoid”…
Cephandrius was used by Raise-Odium and other Splinter god on an epigraph. Both knew him since before Adonalsium was splintered, so probably it’s his real name. I’m sorry, but I don’t remember the name of that Splinter god nor the book nor which chapter that epigraph belongs. I just remember it’s a letter from the god to Cephandrius, saying Raise it’s contained in Roshar and it’s not that dangerous for the Cosmere as Cephandrius claims.
Probably it’s on Oathbringer
Given the now apparently sapient Wind, something from pre-shattering, the absolute reverence from the Shin of stones (won’t walk on them, wont accept metal mined from it), and the fact that the Szeth book was originally tentatively titled ‘Stones Unhallowed’….
Well, lets just say, I am keeping my eyes out for any mention of another being, or intent to pair with the Wind, specifically Stone. Especially given that on the wheel of Radiant orders, we have the following setup: Stonewards-Bondsmiths-Windrunners.
Bondsmiths, who unite all, bracketed by orders that are named for Wind and Stone? I’m definitely dusting off my tinfoil hat.
What about the voice that speaks to Venli when she’s learning to stone shape? The being named Ur.
Not sure if that’s a mid-level spren of that specific mountain/range, or maybe a greatspren of stone.
I thought that “Ur” had referred to the mountain or mountain range that became Ur-ithiru via some unstated process, presumably involving Honor and Cultivation creating the Sibling and performing other modifications to the mountain. So I’m not sure that it specifically would be a candidate for a “Stone” spren, but the overall interaction with Venli leaves open the possibility that the entity there was of a broader scope (just of a different name).
I also wanted to see this connection to the Shin’s Stone Shamanism.
The epigraph mentions the Wind as being potentially replaced by the Storm (which has some decent chance of being the entity that Honor adapted into Stormfather). The Sibling was a creation of Honor and Cultivation and is thus not a contender, but it seems possible to me that the precursor of the Nightwatcher is in play here. I have no reason to make a connection between her and “Stone”, though.
Yeah make Ishar even stronger…so its confirmed that not only he is unchained but in the possesion of all Honorblades from Shinovar…he is without a doubt strongest in cosmere not considering Shards right now…i like the way Syl is hyping up every time his name is mentioned…its going to be epic and i got bad feeling that after Szeth swore 4th ideal he will fight Kal
or he and Kal together will fight Ishar
I was beginning to wonder if the epigraph author might be a Singer, and this excerpt has me going that direction even more. I think it’s important that Notum doesn’t want to bond a human…but who says a Windrunner has to be human? Maybe Notum will form the first Singer (or Listener) Windrunner bond.
It is pretty interesting that in the earlier version of this chapter that we had from an old reading, Notum goes to organise a honorspren fleet to fight voidspren in Shadesmar. This isn’t mentioned here, but maybe that’s what he’ll end up doing still.
If he is going to bond a singer, I submit Thude, Eshonai’s second-in-command, who led the remains of their people away through the chasms.
Yeah, this is one of those moments where you have to yell at the character for not knowing what is going on elsewhere in-universe — “so go bond a Singer already!”
I’m surprised not to see any discussion yet regarding Towerlight being used by Radiants while within a certain radius of the tower but then the light failing them beyond it. We’ve got Lift using Lifelight she metabolizes herself, Radiants using Stormlight from spheres/the storm, and seemingly everyone (though I suppose I don’t think we know for sure with Lift) using Towerlight, but only when in the right places… what other limitations are there on the various lights? And could previously unusable light become useable under the right conditions? Could it be that Kal himself even used voidlight back in RoW during/after his final confrontation with The Pursuer? How might this play into the Night of Sorrows? Hmmmm…
I was also interested in the depiction of Radiants using Towerlight and its limitations. The situation depicted here, where it only works “nearby” does have some reasonable analogues in science, where the presence of a localized “field” enables some other effect of note. (One example is an MRI machine, where the magnetic field inside the machine causes the otherwise-equivalent “spin up” and “spin down” nuclear states to become different, so you can pump some energy into them with radio waves and watch how they respond, then do some fancy math to turn it into an image.)
So it seems like the tower (or more likely the Sibling specifically) is both providing an ambient source of Towerlight and providing a field that allows Radiants to access it. Since the Sibling needed to be able to hear her father’s song in order to find her own song and produce Towerlight, I would venture to suppose that the “rhythm of the tower” (do we actually have a real name for it? The passage in Ch 110 of RoW only names “the pure tone of Lifelight” as Cultivation’s song) is fundamental to both effects. We’ve seen the Fused make Voidlight by singing the right song, so I would expect that the Sibling makes the Towerlight by singing her song, presumably coupled with some physical formation that’s analogous to the gemheart of the fused (the Sibling has manifested itself as quite a few fabrials and it would be easy to assume the proper form for producing Light, whatever that form is). I would similarly expect that in order to be able to power surgebindings with Towerlight, the Radiants would need to be attuned to the rhythm of the tower. Since Radiants need to be bonded to a spren to surgebind at all, we could certainly posit that the Sibling forms a Connection to the relevant spren and in doing so opens the Radiant to the rhythm of the tower and the ability to use Towerlight. We even have specific evidence from chapter 2 of WaT that the Sibling has some attraction to spren of all kinds (“That was another difference in the tower lately–spren were everywhere, showing up far more frequently.”), so I think that whatever is attracting spren is also opening them to the rhythm of the tower.
This theory for the creation of Towerlight (and Voidlight) does leave open an interesting question of where the latent Investiture is coming from that’s getting imprinted by the relevant rhythm so as to become the corresponding type of Light. I don’t have a good theory yet, myself.
It also leaves open a question of whether you could use Towerlight for surgebinding granted by an Honorblade rather than a Nahel bond — would there be a Connection to the rhythm of the tower?
In considering the authorship of the in-world KoWaT, another thought struck me… It’s a long shot, but hear me out: Gavinor. If the Wind was only able to speak again after the ascension of a new vessel, and the Wind has been speaking to the author since childhood, could Gavinor be a contender, possibly authoring the book during the second arc?
Three of sixteen ruled, but now the Broken One reigns.”
“He must pick it up, the fallen title! The tower, the crown, and the spear!”
Death rattles from the way of kings. so, kaladin is definitely becoming king in urithiru uh? And it seems to me that dalinar and navani are dying on this one
May comments to Chapter 5
· Could it be Sigzil who wrote the epigraph? I would not consider Kaladin or Szeth either a philosopher or historian. The more chapters we get, the less certain I am of who wrote this.
· I do not understand what Shallan means with this quote: “A Herald to add to her collection. She might have said this was the rarest of gems to obtain, but was a Herald actually rarer than anyone else? One might argue that due to their immortality, they were less so.” Why would one argue that due to the Heralds’ immortality, they were less rare than those who are not immortal? If someone understands Shallan’s point, please explain.
· Shallan’s description of how she feels when she draws sounds like Wit talking in an epilogue. Both performers at heart: Shallan drawing and Wit storytelling. I wonder if this similar aspect of their personalities is why Wit feels a type of fondness to Shallan.
· Given how Adolin feels about Dalinar at this point, I would not have been surprised had Adolin said he will take the long way home so he can stay with Galliant.
· As Kalak was actually in Chapter 5, on would have thought there would have been at least one depiction of him in the arch at the beginning of the chapter.
She means that since they are immortal, you would have more chances to run into them than someone who only lives a normal lifespan which could be very short.
My comments to Chapter 6
· Interesting both Wind and the Heralds vanished. I am more curious as when the author is writing rather than what happened to Wind and the Heralds. Did the Hearlds all die and go to the Beyond? Did the Heralds agree to reform the Oathpact and get sent off Roshar? If they did, I would be willing to bet a month’s mortgage payment that the reforged Oathpact does not work the same way and they do not have to go to Braize. I think the author of the Knights of Wind and Truth is writing that book after the events of Book 10 of SA and not Book 5. Just a hunch.
· “A surgeon for the mind—who didn’t cut with a scalpel, but with calm words and understanding. Storms, that seemed so much more difficult.” Good description for a psychologist. If Kaladin had thought about administering some type of medication, then Kaladin would be a psychiatrist.
· Way to just drop in an important new character Brandon. A Fourth Order Stoneward. Something tells me we will see a bit of Dami in Book 5; and a lot more or Dami in Books 6-10. He likely will be a viewpoint character, but not a flashback character. Perhaps someone as central to the last 5 books as Navani and Adolin are to the 1st 5 books.
· Dalinar’s transition from warlord to diplomat/pacifist mirrors the transformation Nohadon made from warrior to the sage king who wrote The Way of Kings.
· Drew. I believe Kaldin already fulfilled this death rattle “He must pick it up, the fallen title! The tower, the crown, and the spear!” I think this refers to what Kaladin did at the end of WoR. Elohkar had fallen (into despair). Kaladin stood by his side when he had lost his powers.
Regarding the surgeon of the mind bit… Kaladin is Roshar’s first Psychologist! Perhaps someday he’ll learn to apply medicines to people stricken with mental disorders and level up.
What if the author of the epigraph is Hessi, who wrote about the Unmade in “Mythica”? (See “Oathbringer” epigraphs.) And I’ve seen someone speculate that Hessi is actually Hessina, Kaladin’s mother, who has a little bit of a mysterious past…
Hessina’s past is no longer as mysterious after RoW, is it? Her native town and her father were mentioned there.
I suspect one of the Heralds has authored “Mythica”.
Oh, I forgot they were mentioned! Do you remember where?
There is a chapter (an Interlude?) featuring just Lirin and Hessina talking. It’s there.
I think the writer of the in world WaT is Sigzil. He mentioned feeling the wind as a youth, implying he was a Windrunner in an earlier chapter, and Kal and Szeth are probably the witnesses to the purge in Shinovar. We know he survives, too.
I’m interested in the fact that windrunners can easily travel to Shadesmar. I think the book will end with windrunners evacuating people on Roshar to a different planet – maybe back to Ashyn?
They can use the Oathgate in Urithiru to access Shadesmar, and stormlight-powered flight within Shadesmar.
Other Radiants with living blades could also get to Shadesmar via Oathgate but would be fairly immobile once there.
Is it possible that the epigraphs are written by Khriss, or someone who is so far from left field that they are not a Rosharan?
Spoilers for Sunlit Man
My theory to support the idea of Sigzil as the writer of “The Knights of Wind and Truth”: I believe this will be a new order combining Windrunners and Skybreakers. Szeth was “Truthless” (when I’m fact he was the only one who recognized Truth) and is currently the only Skybreaker on the side of the humans. I believe they will fracture with Szeth being the head of the new order. That’s the Truth part.
Kaladin, the other one on the journey to Shinovar and most likely the other witness, is a Windrunner, so he is the Wind and Szeth is the Truth.
Sigzil is currently a Windrunner, but we know from “Sunlit Man” that at some point he bonds a Skybreaker spren. How this happens, we don’t know – yet.
My theory is either the two orders (Windrunners and Skybreakers that follow Szeth – maybe he picks up some squires in Shinover idk) combine into one order: Wind and Truth or a completely new order is formed from individuals bonding two sprens (like Shallan did, but of 2 separate orders). While it has been said that it is forbidden now to bond 2 sprens, this may all change after the final showdown with Todium. I just think that since we know Sigzil is will have bonded 2 sprens (follower of Kaladin and possibly later a follower of Szeth), it makes sense that he is the author of the book.
See, my thought of kind of paralleling Mistborn era 1 (and probably the worst-case scenario) is that Dalinar ascends to Honor but loses the contest of champions – an ending that is an ascension but instead of the hero saving everyone it’s pretty much the worst possible outcome, as now T. Odium effectively has two shards at his command without the negatives Sazed experiences. Could also be the foundation of his plan to conquer and control the cosmere – get vessels sworn to Odium to ascend to the shards, creating a sort of pantheon with himself as the Zeus-like figure at its head.
Yeah, something similar was occurring to me in the past couple weeks as we worry about who is going to die and who is going to Ascend — there’s a pretty strong case that technically, when you Ascend your body dies. And in a contest to the death, that means you lose. I’m not sure whether I think that’s the loophole that TOdium saw, though.
Yeah I don’t know that this will be the loophole for TOdium to beat Dalinar, but even if it’s not I think it would be fascinating to have one shard own another’s soul like that – and I think the focus on Shards being unable to break their word sets up this kind of inter-shard dynamic quite well. Plus, assuming whatever Rosharan pantheon we end up with survives book 10, it would be an interesting contrast to Bavadin/Autonomy’s method of creating avatars in later books
There’s an interesting question of “literally unable to break their word” vs “breaking their word would leave a hole in them that other shards could use to kill them”, as I seem to recall that Odium used the latter formulation in the conversation with Dalinar where they agreed to the contract. Break your word enough times and you’d probably end up splintered…
Paige said “Do you think Shallan will somehow get into the Spiritual Realm to find Mishram? If so, how? We know precious little about the Spiritual Realm (at least I do!) but other than Dalinar uniting the realms to create Honor’s Perpendicularity, I don’t know how anyone would access it.”
Remember, the Oathgates send people through the spiritual realm to transport them. That is why its instant, time and distance don’t mater in the Spiritual realm. This is confirmed by WoB and by his explanations that instant travel, like the skipping in Sunlit man involves the Spiritual realm vs cognitive. So that is one way to get to the Spiritual realm. Elsecallers, like Jasnah may also be able to reach it.
What scares the heck out of me is thinking about what might happen to the Stormfather and by extension Roshar if something happens to Dalinar. Especially if BAM isn’t back in play yet. I wonder if the Wind is a small part of The Stormfather or rather the storm, because didn’t Brandon say that the storm existed there before Odium, Honor, and Cultivations arrival? As people started to worship Honor instead of the Wind, maybe the Stormfather grew in presence while the Wind shrank? And if something happens with Dalinars bond with him, would that make the Wind/Stormfather disappear (at least for a time)? I am no realmatic theory expert so maybe I’m way off. Still scary to think about though!
I think we are being too “on the nose” with the epigraphs. It is not like Brandon to write these things so plainly that it is really Kal and Szeth and the author of the epigraphs is a character we know like Jasnah or Sigzil.
So what is Brandon really trying to do here? Remember this is a Book End to the first series before the time gap. He needs to close some threads and what is a thread that he started in The Way of Kings? In the Prelude from The Way of Kings, he tells us about the Heralds breaking the Oathpact and then disappearing. The thread of the consequences of breaking the Oathpact need to be closed too.
Firstly, why is Szeth a Knight of Truth? Skybreakers don’t really have anything to do with truth, but with Justice. He is currently considered a Truthless and even though his original “lie” turned out to be true, it doesn’t mean that he is interested in or will become some overt Truth seeker.
The Heralds disappeared once before. So the epigraphs could be talking about the original disappearance not a future one.
The wind clearly has been missing for a while already. So the epigraph could be talking about this disappearance as well, not a future one.
Shinovar could have been cleansed many times in the last 4000 years. We don’t really know what cleansing means, but given the nature of Truth and Shinovar it is easy to see how liars or corrupt leaders can sully Shinovar more than once.
I say these epigraphs are old and we are hearing a different story than the one in the current time. The evidence supporting this being a modern epigraph is just not very strong yet.
As an aside, I also want to posit that Truth is also an ancient abstract god from the Old Magic who speaks to people just like the Wind is and will probably make an appearance later on. Thus the Knights of Wind and Truth are those who serve these ancient gods as told in this epigraph and thus Kal and Szeth will inherit this mantle but it will be told in the regular novel not the epigraph.
I like this theory.
I agree that Truth is likely not a reference to Szeth. Seems to me to be more likely to be a reference to Shallan given how her oaths tie to speaking truths. I thought the title of the book was about Kaladin and Shallan each speaking the fifth ideal.
I was hoping it was Renarin given that he is a Truthwatcher and we haven’t really seen him since Oathbringer. He must have a view from Fortune on who Dalinar is going to choose for his Champion and whether they can succeed or not. Is Renarin going to be Dalinar’s Champion?? There is very little evidence to support this, but I would love to see it.
I just want to pipe in with my long held theory that unite them actually refers to the spren. That, United, they might actually become the god of Roshar. Also, holy heck, Hoid’s real name! That got my attention.
Something I haven’t considered. Maybe not at all related. But, anyone else hoping Shallan meets her mother (if all theories about her mother turn out true) and that is how they really learn how to find Mishram?
And maybe this is how Shallan repairs her oaths with Testament. She seems to have blamed Testament for the death of her mother. But if her mother isn’t really dead, maybe the mental block of her blame will be released and restore the bond with Testament.
A handful of thoughts that I don’t see anyone having mentioned yet:
The epigraphs mention the Heralds as if they were a potential source of information about the cleansing of Shinovar (but since they vanished, they are no longer a useful source). Why would the Heralds be relevant for this? Ash and Taln should still be at Urithiru, but I guess maybe some others went back for their blades and got caught up in some Unmade-driven craziness?
If the population of Lasting Integrity is only in the hundreds, I’m not sure I’d actually want to reduce the population a lot more than 20-50 in order to ensure that it can be defended from the Fused. So while twelve is still “only”, it does not actually seem so small a number in comparison.
If the Sibling is amplifying Cultivation’s influence over the city to help it flourish with life, I wonder if it is also amplifying Honor’s influence over the city in some way … and what effects that would have.
I haven’t read all the comments to see how popular the theory is but I think ::: Cosmere SPOILER ahead:::
Wasn’t sure how to mark it, but definitely a spoiler for other Cosmere books.
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A good candidate is Sig for the author of TKoWaT. He is a scholar and he bonds both an honor and high spren eventually so he seems connected to the orders of Szeth and Kaladin. He also started as a Windrunner so it’s possible he heard the wind calling him when he was a child. And Wit may have been especially interested in an apprentice that could hear the Wind.
Regarding the wind and its potential connection to Adonalsium, I also can’t help but think that in a lot of Scripture the divine is mentioned as wind or breath. Particularly in some translations of Genesis, the spirit hovering over the formless (heh) waters is a ‘wind’.