Welcome back to A Read of Ice and Fire! Please join me as I read and react, for the very first time, to George R.R. Martin’s epic fantasy series A Song of Ice and Fire.
Today’s entry is Part 10 of A Dance With Dragons, in which we cover Chapter 15 (“Davos”) and Chapter 16 (“Daenerys”).
Previous entries are located in the Index. The only spoilers in the post itself will be for the actual chapters covered and for the chapters previous to them. As for the comments, please note that the Powers That Be have provided you a lovely spoiler thread here on Tor.com. Any spoileriffic discussion should go there, where I won’t see it. Non-spoiler comments go below, in the comments to the post itself.
And now, the post!
Chapter 15: Davos
What Happens
Disguised as a common sailor, Davos arrives at White Harbor in a manner quite different from his original planned entrance. He notes new fortifications along the shore, as well as new jetty walls which he speculates may hide warships. He thinks of how the brothers at Eastwatch had assured him that Lord Manderly would never ally with the Boltons, but Lord Borrell had told him that was exactly what he was going to do. As his ship docks, he sees a warship bearing King Tommen’s banner, and his heart sinks, knowing the Freys are already here.
He goes into the city, which is crowded with refugees. He learns from an apple seller that Lord Manderly is recruiting troops. He goes to a vile dive to listen to sailors’ gossip. He mostly hears things he already knows, but also some new things: that Robett Glover is in the city trying to raise men without success, and that the Dustins and Ryswells are joining Roose Bolton to fight the ironmen at Moat Cailin. One sailor opines that Manderly had better join Bolton too, but another reminds them that the lions have Manderly’s son. Davos says he thought the Freys had killed the son, but the other tells him they killed one son, Wendel; the other, Wylis, is still a prisoner. Davos is deeply dismayed by this news, knowing what he himself would be willing to do for any of his own sons.
They argue about rumors of dragons, and Davos corrects them on the name of the Targaryen princess, Daenerys. Another sailor tells how he talked with the steward of the Sloe-Eyed Maid in Pentos, who told him how a silver-haired girl with three dragons tried to book passage with them to Westeros, but the captain turned her away. Davos knows that captain’s voyage ended badly, but thinks to himself he will go with his remaining sons and see those dragons someday.
He leaves the dive and considers what to do. He thinks he is too late, and debates whether it is even worth making the plea to Manderly. He remembers the story Ser Axell Florent had told at the feast before his departure from Eastwatch, where he slyly compared Davos to an ape in prince’s clothing, and decides he has gone through too much to get to White Harbor to not at least attempt to fulfill his duty. He climbs the hill to Lord Manderly’s keep, and sees the twenty-three new warships in the inner harbor.
The gates of the New Castle had been closed, but a postern opened when he shouted, and a guard emerged to ask his business. Davos showed him the black and gold ribbon that bore the royal seals. “I need to see Lord Manderly at once,” he said. “My business is with him, and him alone.”
Commentary
…Hokay.
So, this was certainly a chapter with words in it.
I mean, it was very descriptive and mise en scene-y—Martin is kind of extraordinarily good at getting you to picture a place—but as a general thing I like at least some plot movement to go with my scenery, you know?
I mean basically what happened here was that Davos arrived in White Harbor, listened to a bunch of gossip about stuff we already knew, and then agonized for a while before doing exactly what we all knew he would do anyway. No, I’m sorry, starting to do what we knew he would do; he didn’t even get as far as actually doing it. Blah, boring.
The only thing during the “gossip” section of this chapter that really caught my eye at all was this:
Sandor Clegane had turned outlaw and was plundering and killing in the lands along the Trident;
Which, since I’m pretty sure I remember that Sandor is currently legally dead and peacefully shoveling horse dung in a monastery somewhere (or something like that), this has to be someone else (she says, duhfully). Maybe it’s Sallador? Dunno.
Down past where Old Fishfoot’s trident pointed was an alley where they sold fried cod, crisp and golden brown outside and flaky white within.
[…] Inside the Eel, time stood still. The barrel-vaulted ceiling was stained black with soot, the floor was hard-packed earth, the air smelled of smoke and spoiled meat and stale vomit.
Martin has a remarkable facility for making one thing sound incredibly appealing in just a few words, and then following it up with something equally as disgusting a moment later. It’s a gift, I suppose.
Steffon and Stannis were thousands of leagues from the fighting and safe from harm, but Devan was at Castle Black, a squire to the king.
Wow, he even named one of his sons after the guy who cut off his fingers. Davos Seaworth, what even are you.
And, yeah. There was nothing else worth talking about in this chapter, so let’s move on, shall we?
Chapter 16: Daenerys
What Happens
Xaro Xhoan Daxos has come to visit Dany from Qarth, bringing erotic dancers and other gifts. Dany hopes to persuade him to trade with Meereen, whose formerly slave-based economy is suffering. The end of the dance makes her think of Daario, who is returning to the city with an alliance with Lhazar. Xaro plies her with outrageous flattery and tearful worries about her safety, as well as an insincere proposal of marriage. But he soon moves on to the subject of slavery, and tries to convince her that slavery is a necessary evil. She is shaken by his arguments, but does not accept them. He asks to speak to her privately.
She takes him to her chambers, but keeps Barristan with her. Xaro tells her baldly that he is not interested in trade with Meereen, and that she will only bring the city to destruction as she did with Astapor. He tells her Yunkai is gathering forces and allies to bring against her, and if she goes to meet them, Meereen will rise up behind her. He tells her that he has brought her a gift: thirteen galleys to carry her home to Westeros, as she had originally asked him for in Qarth. She asks for what price, and he insists that there is none, only her promise that she will go. She asks what will happen if she decides to wait, and he tells her he does not expect her to last very long if so. He says the Yunkai’i are not her only enemies, and reminds her of the existence of the warlock Pyat Pree. Dany tells him she will have the ships inspected before giving her answer.
After Xaro leaves, she asks Barristan’s opinion. Barristan is all for it, but Dany thinks that there must be some kind of trap here. Nevertheless she wakes up the next day full of excitement at the idea of leaving Meereen behind and going back to Westeros. At audience, she once again tells Lord Ghael that she will not send aid to Astapor, and he spits on her. Strong Belwas breaks his teeth, but Dany stops them from doing worse, and sends him away. Later she meets with her council, and Admiral Groleo tells her the ships are sound enough to make it to Westeros. Reznak wails that she is abandoning them, then, to be raped and slaughtered, and Dany says they can come with her. Symon Stripeback, one of her new mercenary captains, points out that thirteen ships are not enough to transport all of Dany’s people, and Rommo says the Dothraki will refuse to ride in a ship. Grey Worm suggests they could go overland with the ships following the coastline, but the Shavepate says the foot troops would not survive traveling the demon road. Reznak moans that the ones she leaves behind will suffer even worse fates. Finally, Dany orders them all silent, and decides that she cannot leave Meereen just yet. Barristan begs her to reconsider, but she says she will not abandon Meereen as she did Astapor.
Xaro brings her a huge tapestry map as a gift, and Dany tells him she will accept the ships and use them for trade, but she cannot leave for Westeros yet. Xaro weeps crocodile tears and says if she does not, she will surely “die screaming”. He says he should have killed her in Qarth; furious, she warns him never to threaten her again, and orders him gone by morning. He leaves the city, but leaves the thirteen galleys behind, decorated with long red streamers.
And when Daenerys descended to hold court, a messenger from the ships awaited her. He spoke no word but laid at her feet a black satin pillow, upon which rested a single bloodstained glove.
“What is this?” Skahaz demanded. “A bloody glove…”
“…means war,” said the queen.
Commentary
Well, shit.
And Dany continues unbroken her trend of making me simultaneously super proud and super exasperated at her. I mean, objectively it’s awesome that Dany is standing on her principles and refusing to cut and run… but Jesus, she had a chance to get out of this clusterfuck, and get on with what she was supposed to be doing.
Sigh. But, from a moral-ish point of view she is right, I guess… assuming her decision doesn’t get them all killed anyway, of course. But then, it’s not like invading Westeros with thirteen ships is exactly a risk-free endeavor either, is it?
Basically, I suppose if all of your choices are crappy, you should probably just go with the one that will make you feel the least guilty?
Bleh. I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again: ruling things SUCKS.
Either way, what an interestingly devious ploy on Qarth’s part, eh? Dany was convinced there was a trap in Xaro’s gift, but I think that there really wasn’t one. They wanted her gone, pure and simple, so as to restore everything in the slaver cities back to the status quo, and I think if Dany had actually taken the ships and left to go harass Westeros instead, that really might have been the end of it.
Of course, I also think that Xaro shot himself in the foot a little by making the offer so niggardly. If Qarth had provided enough ships that Dany could have taken all of her people, instead of presenting her with such a logistical quandary, the chances she would have accepted would have been much higher.
Well, too late now, isn’t it, either way. And now Dany is officially completely surrounded by enemies. Great.
Oh, except the Lamb Men. Greeeeaaat.
Well, this should be an interesting situation for the various suitors to blunder into, won’t it. Just in case it wasn’t quite enough of a giant mess already to qualify for Official Clusterfuck Status, right? HAHAHA
Assuming that’s actually going to happen at some point, of course—the suitors showing up, I mean. At this rate I’m not very optimistic about the chances of that happening in this book, but hopefully I’m wrong about that.
“Ask yourself, if all men must grub in the dirt for food, how shall any man lift his eyes to contemplate the stars? If each of us must break his back to build a hovel, who shall raise the temples to glorify the gods? For some men to be great, others must be enslaved.”
Despite knowing perfectly well that, even today, there are in fact an appalling number of people who think this way, in the sense of truly believing that some people’s lives are inherently worth less than others, based on what is (objectively) completely arbitrary criteria, it still fills me with what I suppose is a naïve bafflement and… sorrow. People are people; where or how or with what aspects you were born with does not change that. Or shouldn’t.
But then, I think that for quite a lot of these people it is not so much that they genuinely believe this, but rather that it is to their advantage for things to be that way, and screw whether it’s actually true or not. Greed trumping principle, and all of that. Which is probably even more contemptible than being a true believer, actually.
Look, I know perfectly well that true equality has never been a reality in human history thus far, but I don’t care. And I also know that deep down everyone, including me, has at least a trace of that same self-serving bias, otherwise I wouldn’t have also been instinctively exasperated at Dany for not leaving Meereen. That truth doesn’t mean that aiming for achieving true equality is not still a worthy goal.
And it also doesn’t mean that taking advantage of that inequality for one’s own gain isn’t a thoroughly loathsome practice. Because it is. And if it makes me naïve to say so, so be it. Better that than the alternative.
Anyway.
The old knight took pains not to look at her bare breast as he spoke to her. Ser Jorah would not turn his eyes away. He loved me as a woman, where Ser Barristan loves me only as his queen.
I love how Dany seems to regard this as a flaw on Barristan’s part, when if you ask me that makes Barristan possibly the most awesome person in her entire entourage. Jeez, Dany, having people look at you as a ruler first and a woman second is the frickin’ dream. Appreciate it where you’ve got it, damn.
But speaking of breasteseses (and other sex organs!), I totally burst out laughing at the “dance” at the beginning of the chapter. Because of course Martin would go to the logical extreme of having erotic dancers just straight-up fuck on the dance floor. Ha! So ridiculous. So… ASOIAF.
This story, I swear.
And that’s all for the nonce, kiddies! I’m off to see the parades, literally, and I’ll see you next Thursday! Happy Mardi Gras!
I understand the comment about plot movement with Davos. I remember, though, when I was reading this chapter it was helping me place where in time Davos was as compared to the AffC, since they are roughly supposed to be occurring at the same time. I figure that keeping up with other plot movement that we already know of counts.
I also appreciate the many subtle ways that the word-of-mouth process affects the news. I find such things humorous. We have an idea of what’s been going on with the Freys and the Boltons, but Davos does not. It’s interesting to watch how misinformation or lack of information has sometimes impacted our heroes’ decision-making.
Heroes, apparently, is a term I use very loosely.
Leigh – we know from AFFC what was up with “Sandor Clegane” (sic) rampaging through the Trident. One of the downsides of having a distinctive helmet and you losing it on the road….
Agree that the Davos chapter is all atmosphere and no cattle, not that there’s anything wrong with that every once in a while.
Not only did Davos name a kid after Stannis, he named his younger son after Stannis’ Dad….
Anytime someone says their family is located “far from the fighting and safe from harm” in ASOIF it makes me very nervous. Just saying.
I actually liked the Davos chapter. White Harbor is kinda cool. I want some of that thick black beer that sells for as much as Arbour Gold in Braavos. Mmmmmm, thick beer…..And perfectly fried battered fish to go with it….
Yes, most of what Davos learns in this chapter is not news to the reader, but the movement of Davos’ plotline to match where we left the other plotlines in AFFC takes some time, and at least we get a good look at a new setting in this chapter. I personally like big cities, and White Harbor is the smallest city in Westeros, but I still think it might be my choice of places to live there (though I’d probably rather live in Braavos across the Narrow Sea).
Dany’s chapter further illustrates her dillema. Her biggest problem is that she is lost: throughout the first few books, she was always moving forward, from her marriage to the birth of the dragons to the acquisition of the Unsullied and the sacking of Slaver’s Bay. But now she’s bogged down, and her enemies are catching up to her. She repeatedly says “If I look back I am lost”, but she has stopped looking forward. Barristan is right that her goal is Westeros, and she has no good options remaining to her in Meereen. Now Dany is stuck there, with Yunkai and Qarth and all their allies against her, and without any means of escape.
If only there was someone with hundreds of ships who might be coming for her… Hmmmmm….. (Hope this doesn’t get flagged, that was literally my main thought throughout these Meereen chapters on first read, not a spoiler).
Well, I do appreciate Martin’s world building. White Harbour is an important city to the North, probably second only to Winterfell as a location of importance (not counting the Wall obviously), so we needed to see it.
George probably wishes Xaro had offered hundreds of ships as well, because this took him 5 years to figure out.
Ah, Leigh is beginning to get to understand the full picture of the Meereenese Knot (don’t Google that, there be spoilers). It sure tells a great (if convoluted) story, but the threads are too many to count.
Re: Sandor Clegane – if you recall, when Brienne was traveling in the Riverlands, she also heard a lot of rumors regarding Sandor’s plundering.
Re: Davos’ sons names – Steffon Baratheon was Stannis’ dad, so Davos named two of his sons after the family that took away his fingers.
Re: Xaro’s niggardly offer – Someone blank this if it is explicitly shown after this specific chapter, but I was under the impression that each one of the Thirteen masters of Qarth sent only one ship. Which makes the offer even cheaper, since Xaro could have thrown a few more ships of his own.
Re: Barry’s chasteness – I didn’t get the vibe that Dany was regarding it as a flaw, only was noticing the difference between the two knights that served her.
I really enjoy the beginning of ‘Dance.’ We essentially get a Tyrion, Jon, Dany, Davos, Bran/Theon rotation which is great.
Leigh is right, that these two chapters cover relatviely little ground, especially Davos’. However, there has been a ton going on before this, so I suppose it’s good to have a little break.
I haven’t posted in a couple weeks, but since it’s a little bit of a slow week (in terms of plot progression), I wanted to rehash on some stuff from the last couple of weeks.
I was shocked Leigh didn’t immediately pick up on (roll over for spoilers who the three-eyed crow was. I mean, he comes out and says his name…and Bran thinks, oh, I have an uncle with that same name. And the Three-Eyed Crow says he has a thousand eyes and one…who else has a thousand eyes and one???? Come on! I was so looking forward to Leigh’s reaction.
I was not disappointed by her reaction to the Theon reveal though. I believe she called that way back when Theon disappeared from the narrative that he wasn’t truly dead. (That, of course, was years ago though since she made that prediction and she may not remember.
This was about the time I started to really get frustrated with Dany. Storm of Swords Dany was awesome, and her story was one that made that book so great (the single best book I’ve read, let alone of the series). However, in Dance, I fear she’s become indecisive or overwhelmed, one or the other anyways, which has left her stagnated.
Dance offers a great reflection of Jon as a young leader, and Dany as a young leader, and the trials they face. Obviously, the obsacles in front of them are different. I’ve always favored Jon, maybe because his perspective is more dire, idk. But, it’s an interesting study.
I think Tyrion’s story up until this point is the most interesting. He is headed towards Dany at the behest of Varys and Illyrio who have supposedly been on Dany’s side from “A Game of Thrones.” He’s with the mysterious Griff, Young Griff, and Septa Lemore. The middle of which is to be offered as a suitor to Dany. There must be more going on there. There’s also Quentyn who seems to be acting opposite of Tyrion as he wishes to marry Dany himself, and he is closer to Dany than those on the poleboat. This whole situation gets interesting, and I can’t wait to discuss my thoughts on them once we get there. I most want to discuss what everyone thinks of Tyrion as the book goes on.
Moderator note: message edited to hide some possible spoilers.
Chapter 15 – Davos:A little overview of the harbor and then the sighting of the Lionstar doesn’t seem entirely good. That and no seals.
Davos waits for gossip and we get a bit about the various possible Targ heirs.
Hmm, and that seems about it. He’s going to see Lord Manderly there at the end, but the pace of that chapter seemed a tad on the slow side.
Bye-bye, Iron Islands; my Westeros allegiance is moving to White Harbor. Less violence, better seafood, more mermen (albeit in image and statue form), and ///everything about House Manderly ///. I can serve my Drowned Deity much more enjoyably over here.
“…the denizens of the Belly of the Whale.” HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
The Lazy Eel reminds me of the Stinking Goose in Maidenpool (AFFC). As Terry Pratchett says, “There’s a bar like it in every town.”
Welcome to the Meerenese Knot!
I like Dany’s chapter, because it starts to show the coalition that’s forming against her, involving not only Yunkai, but also Qarth and probably other states. You can’t expect to change the status quo without someone trying to change it back. Very napoleonic thing we’re seeing here.
@5 DougL- White Harbor is actually the ONLY city in the North. Winterfell is just a castle with a winter town around it. There a couple of towns in the North, most notably Barrowton, which seems to be fairly sizeable, but no true cities other than White Harbor, which is also the smallest of the 5 cities in Westeros (the others being Kings Landing, Oldtown, Lannisport, and Gulftown, in order of size).
I love Barristan in this book. He’s got his flaws, as does everyone, and we could debate them at length, but I still think he’s full of awesome…
@7: There’s a slight spoiler in your post ///since the 3EC will give his revelatory name in the next Bran chapter///. I think I flagged the post; would a mod white it out that bit?
@6-That’s right. Each of the thirteen sent a ship. However, I completely agree with leigh. My thought when I read this chapter was, if they had sent Dany 50 ships, or whatever number she needed, they would have been rid of her. Ultimately, there goal was for Dany to leave peacefully, right? She’s proven to be a menace militarily. I’m sure they would prefer to avoid a violent confronatation if possible. Like Illyrio said in A Game of Thrones about the Dothraki, why fight if you can buy them off so cheap? I think if they gave her a suitable number of ships she would leave. But, they didn’t. We established in A Clash of Kings, that Xaro and the others at Qarth have adequate number of ships to give such a gift–but they don’t. It’s puzzling.
My only explaination is, that they intentionally wanted the bulk of Dany’s people to remain at Mereen, so they could enslave them once again. Otherwise, where would the Qartheens, and Yunkai get slaves to kickstart their trade once Dany was gone?
Yeah, not a lot of action in the Davos chapter, but it does some work in setting the scene, laying out what the Boltons and Lannisters are doing to bring the North to heel.
As for Dany, sigh. It was inevitable, I guess – she sided with the poor and powerless, which means now all the rich and powerful want her gone. I wonder how many of these enemies of hers have heard about the dragons being essentially out of the picture as weapons…
@13-I thought he said it in that chapter. I’d delete my post if I could (considering).
The return of Ducksauce. Yes! Mili Skane jokes can start in 3…2…1…
Really nice point that Qarth should have got together with Slavers Bay citystates and put together a really kickass boat offering that would induce Dany to leave. This dog just didn’t hunt.
The issue of Barristan and the breast is a great illustration that Dany is still a teenager (and a sex-craved one to boot), lacking maturity and wisdom. Hope she can do better on this as things move forward.
Yeah, the Davos chapter was essentially to remind everyone what had happened in AFFC during the time it took Martin to finish this book.
Poor Dany
I’m hearing Miley Cyrus’s voice in my head, singing, “It’s the slog”.
Can’t this thing go any faster???
I’m not sure what I think about the concept of Westeros being Dany’s true place. It was Viserys’s dream to go there, but I didn’t feel that it was something she wanted for herself. Its just the destination she choose in ACOK because there wasn’t anywhere else. But with Mereen now an option, I could see her deciding that this was where she belonged and just staying there forever. (Assuming she isn’t defeated and forced to flee obviously)
@19 – To paraphrase Miley only a little, “It’s a Party in Slaver’s Bay….”
Also, if more boats were all that was needed to induce Dany to leave, why didn’t she ask Xaro for more boats? No reason negotiations couldn’t have gone forth if leaving had been a serious option.
@11. MDNY
Can you please read my full post? And it’s not the only “city” I think Barrowtown qualifies to some regard.
Dany thinks Jorah “had given her good counsel.” Um, what? Like convincing her to go to Astapor and buy some Unsullied, thus touching off this catasterous disastrophe?
Reading Ana Mardoll’s fascinating Narnia deconstructions, I gained new appreciation for ASOIAF’s moral ambiguity. If you’ll pardon a tangential comparison:
One of Ana’s major criticisms (along with pointing out ten tons of bigotry) is that the author explicitly designates characters indisputably Good or Evil with variable connection to their actual actions and personalities. The problem isn’t that kings and gods and protagonists sometimes do cruel, stupid, obnoxious, or otherwise disastrous things – this is realistic. It’s that they’re nonetheless treated, narratively and in-universe, as Perfect Noble Heroes and forces of pure benevolence, unless they stray into a few rather petty “sins” (e.g. vanity or forgetting to pray). It’s realistic for antagonists to sometimes have sympathetic qualities or accurate viewpoints – but they’re still Utterly Wicked Sinners unless they get Redeemed by Divine Intervention. It’s realistic for a place to have some unpleasant customs and policies – but this one is supposed to be an idealized Perfect Nation. I don’t agree with everything Ana says, but she makes a good case for this pattern.
GRRM can’t be having with that sort of thing. He doesn’t tell us what to think of his characters, just presents them in their messy glory. We each have to choose our own heroes and villains, and our decisions are often complicated, controversial, and subject to change in accordance with the characters’ ongoing actions. Or we can choose to avoid such labels and take everyone as they are. And while his lands may or may not closely resemble How Things Really Were in their real-life counterparts, few could be considered any decent person’s idea of How Things Should Be.
What to make of a compassionate woman who many of us have long rooted for, but whose efforts at benevolence (spiked with a bit of wrath) have caused immeasurable misery, making her an in-story hero of many and villain to many more? What to make of a decent man who keeps loyally risking his life (albeit partly out of pride at the moment) in service to a jerkass king who might or might not be more benevolent than the other monarch options? Don’t ask the author!
Kyle’s one-liners:
“Oh man, Martin, what –? George, what–? Ohhh, don’t go gettin’ yourself killed, Mr. Davos.”
“Who are all these people? OK, there’s Dany, and Barristan…and then all the other guys…the other people…that are in…over there…”
She had a chance to get on with what the readers expected her to be doing. That is not quite the same thing.
BTW – note that Xaros argument is really an argument against egalitarianism, not for slavery. It is obviously possible to have inequality without also having forced labour.
@14, 22
I think the answer to why the Thirteen didn’t send more ships is probably Dany herself. She started off with threatening to sack their city, she left on slightly unfriendly terms, having also destroyed the warlocks, and proceeded to sack Slaver’s Bay. Depending on the extent to which stories travel or are exaggerated, she does not seem to feel obliged to maintain good relations with the opposite parties to her bargains (hence her acquisition of the Unsullied).
So do the Thirteen want to give Dany enough ships to load up her entire army? I wouldn’t think so. It would not seem surprising to me that they hedged their bets by trying to find a way to get Dany out of Slaver’s Bay, but not giving her enough transport to permit her to land an army at their doorstep either. And if that leaves her shorthanded in her goal to conquer Westeros, well, having her bogged down in an interminable war just means longer before Qarth has to deal with her again.
@24 Good points, but Jorah wasn’t the one who insisted she buy all the Unsullied and sack the city — that was all Dany.
I think it’s safe to say that ADWD is really about the polarity here. When Dany listened to her gut and did things in a much more violent and/or dictatorial manner, we actually rooted for her more. Almost a meta vision of her charisma. But then when she tries to sit in Meereen and “do good”, all I can do is think of her as naive and boring. And Jorah was a large part of her decision making back when she was more interesting.
There are many other juxtapositions as well — before she used her dragons, was spending time with them, training them, and in Meereen she has them locked away. Methinks this might be symbolism -Cpt Obvious.
There is of course a lot more to it–the world setting being a large part. I want Dany to get to Westeros because that’s the place I want her to “fix”. We as readers have no real reason to love Essos or want to be here, because most of our other main players are overseas.
@26-It’s a bit of a tangent to presume what the Qartheens intention is. Her most immediate dangers lie within her own walls–the harpy, and closer to her–the Yunkai. However, yes, she left under uncertain terms. But, I wonder if the thirteen were so dismayed by the destruction of the House of the Undying, and the warlocks. The HBO series would have us think the thirteen were a ruling body of Qarth, but that is not he case. They were merely a faction within Qarth along with the Guild of Spices (I forget their exact name, and don’t feel like searching it at this moment), and the warlocks, amongst others. So, I wonder, how dismayed could the thirteen be at the failure of another rival faction? Xaro was dismayed that he could not procure a dragon by marrying Dany, but otherwise she wasn’t enemies with the Qartheen other than the warlocks–they being the ones that sent the sorrowful man to kill her. I think Xaro and his comrades are just trying to get the best of any situation, as any trader/merchant/Illyrio/Petyr type would…
@27-Great points! I love this forum cause it gives me all sorts of reflection I didn’t get when I read it on my own. Dany was a lot more interesting in Storm when she was tapping into that face of her personality. However, now she is perhaps being more moral: not wanting to leave behind those she rescued, not wanting to leave the same mess in Mereen that she left in Astapor. But, we criticize her.
I mentioned before the parallel between Jon and Dany. Perhaps, I leaned towards Jon because he is protecting a western nation. Myself, as someone from a western civilization have a prejudice against an eastern civilization. Symbolized here by Mereen compared to Westeros. So, I have a naturally desire for Dany to come to Westeros.
Chapter 16 – Daenerys:We start out with a kind of porno version of the Blue Man Group, I guess. Then, some snappy repartee with Xaro.
I’ve got to go with Dany. Cutting and moving on seems a little attractive although it doesn’t seem like you can load very much into 13 ships. Her “conquests” haven’t resulted in a lot of good so far. It seems better to get a useful number of ships and then sail. Maybe she should be hiring some ship builders.
Of course, we know that there are a whole bunch of Ironborn ships heading her way–with lots of strings attached. The prospect of a war seems like it is going to just about coincide with a bunch of suitors showing up. Hmm, pressure much?
I absolutely agree with Gentleman Farmer @@@@@ 26. Whatever good qualities people might project onto the attractive young protagonist who has literally never been seen through any other PoV character’s eyes, her behavior and approach has been unbelievably arrogant and entitled. Especially because the usual excuses of young nobles do not apply to her, since she was not raised with power or without challenges to her will.
Customs like the sacrosanctity of ambassadors and guest right and upholding pledges and promises exist because without a higher power to enforce behavior, all that is left is reciprocity and consistency in action. An ambassador’s person is sacrosanct, so that business can be conducted between powers, and is mutually enforcable. If you harm an ambassador, people will have no qualms about killing your messengers and heralds, and then no one will willingly carry your words. If you violate other customs, no one will trust you again. Daenerys swanned around with her army and dragons, confident in her power, and absolutely wronged the Yunkai. They did her no harm and offered her no injury, but she robbed them just because she didn’t like their culture. She dealt in bad faith with the Astapori before that, and while the means they took to express it are inexcusable, the attitude of Meereenese toward her on her approach is absolutely understandable.
Daenerys is reaping the consequences of her arrogance, and by usurping the rule of Meereen, she has given the enemies she made fair and square something with which they can attack her . Slavery & its abolition is a serious business, and not to be undertaken on a whim by an adolescent with no concept of the long-term consequences of her actions. It’s interesting that Aerona cited an analysis of the Chronicles of Narnia, because one of the things that stuck with me long after I read it as a child was a comment about one evil of slavery is how it renders slaves unfit for taking responsibility and erodes their capacity for self-motivation. It’s easy to free slaves, but the enslavement of people is a only symptom of a sickness that must be cured if you don’t want the enslavement to reoccur. In the USA, something similar happened, when the powers that be lost interest in that effort after a mere decade, and gave the Democrats their head. Soon the former slaves were doing the same work for the same class of masters, in arguably worse conditions, with only the de jure status of freedom to pacify the consciences of the weaker supporters of their rights.
Daenerys’ marching on with an adolescent’s fantasy ideal council in charge of Astapor could have had no other effect.
As far as the choice to reject the offer to go on to Westeros, she does have a responsibility to those who took up her cause in Meereen, like the Shavepate & her steward (Reznak?), but she also has an obligation to the fact that just about everything she has stems from an inheritance based on her royal status in Westeros. One way or another, all her followers come from Illyrio, whether bought with his merchandise, sent to her directly, inherited from the marriage he arranged and funded, or inspired by the dragons that hatched from the eggs he gave her. And she’s done absolutely jack-all for him in return.
She really doesn’t have a clear-cut right choice.
And regarding Davos, he didn’t name his son after the man who cut off his fingers, he named his son after the man who only cut off his fingers, when he was unquestionably guilty of a capital offense. He named his son after a man who raised him up from a criminal to a knight, a high-ranking lord and an admiral. Remember what Stannis said regarding the Mormont girl named after Ned’s sister, that he knows how that game is played…well, he would, wouldn’t he? Davos pushes on with his mission regardless of the difficulties, because that is exactly what Stannis would do for anyone who was ever as nice to him, assuming anyone could be bothered to be nice to him. Most people in power in the Seven Kingdoms seem as unable as readers to look past the shallow criteria of attractiveness and elegantly empty courtesies and ability to charm that has so many prefering a treacherous, self-serving, self-indulgent moral coward who tries to murder children in his first action in the books.
As the Wizard of Oz said “a heart is judged not by how much you love, but by how much you are loved by others.” That a man like Davos would follow Stannis says a lot about his real qualities, and it also says a lot that we repeatedly see through the series that Stannis gives more weight to Davos’ opinions, and more respect to his counsel than many others.
Hah, your comment about Dany and Barristan/Jorah cracked me up. Although it’s possible it was meant more in the sense that she longed for somebody who saw her as a person, not just a title (which is not to say I think leering at breasts is a great indicator of the former…).
I also enjoyed Davos’s summary chapter, and a chance to see White Harbor, too.
@17 – not getting the Mili Skane reference…
@24 On the CS Lewis Critique
At face value that seems to be a somewhat strange critique to level against Lewis given the vast difference in intended audiences, but I think it is an interesting comparison to make.
Lewis makes characters change sides through character actions presignaled via divine intervention vs GRRM makes characters change sides through character actions without the presignals.
In Chronicles of Narnia. Eustace, Edmund, and Tumnus for instance stray into betrayal and murder, which are fairly serious subjects for heros in a childrens novel to be engaging in. Susan apparently leaves the “good side” entirely, so there definately isn’t a fixed ‘good’ or ‘bad’ value attached to many of the important characters.
Lewis actually matches fairly well up with the Biblical stances on the goodness of people – that we’re all Utterly Wicked Sinners unless we’re redeemed by Divine Intervention. Given he was a Christian writing a Christian allegory, this is hardly surprising!
“None is righteous, no, not one;
no one understands; no one seeks for God.
All have turned aside; together they have become worthless; no one does good, not even one.”
“Their throat is an open grave; they use their tongues to deceive.”
“The venom of asps is under their lips.”
“Their mouth is full of curses and bitterness.”
“Their feet are swift to shed blood; in their paths are ruin and misery, and the way of peace they have not known.”
“There is no fear of God before their eyes.”
The point isn’t that some people are inherently good and some people are inherently evil – its that everyone in the story is reliant on Aslan to save and redeem them. Again this matches well with the gospel.
“And you were dead in the trespasses and sins in which you once walked, following the course of this world, following the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that is now at work in the sons of disobedience— among whom we all once lived in the passions of our flesh, carrying out the desires of the body and the mind, and were by nature children of wrath, like the rest of mankind. But God, being rich in mercy, because of the great love with which he loved us, even when we were dead in our trespasses, made us alive together with Christ—by grace you have been saved— and raised us up with him and seated us with him in the heavenly places in Christ Jesus, so that in the coming ages he might show the immeasurable riches of his grace in kindness toward us in Christ Jesus. For by grace you have been saved through faith. And this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God, not a result of works, so that no one may boast.”
People that set themselves against Aslan are leaving themselves on the “Bad” side, refusing a freely given gift, while people that are willing to accept Aslan’s rule and his help are redeemed to the “good” side, no matter how bad their sins are, and regardless of how good their “works” are.
GRRM writes in way that is actually somwhat similar with characters starting as either “good” or “bad”, and then the bad characters occasionally swap polarities – regardless of the severity of their past sins. The biggest difference for the reader is that instead of in book character like Aslan cluing in the reader that the character is now redeemed, the reader is left to to choose if a character is “redeemed”, which makes for more contention among readers if someone is actually “good” or not.
TL;DR
Lewis writes many heros that aren’t fixed in polarity – they instead have bad behavior and can be rescued by Aslan, upon which they swap polarities through that rescue. Lewis matches up fairly well to Christian beliefs in this message that everyone needs Christ’s help switching polarities from against God to for God. GRRM also writes heros that aren’t fixed in polarity – they instead have bad to horrible behavior, and can switch polarities. The only signficant difference is that no Deity besides the author does it for them.
TL;DR2 I can’t seem to make a one sentence description of this post.
Joshua – Along the same lines, I think what makes Jon a more effective leader than Dany is that he’s able to see things in the Wildlings’ culture that he can value, and to negotiate with them based on an understanding of and empathy for their worldview. Dany’s following along with the clothing and trappings of Meereenese culture, but inwardly she still hates all of it (and Martin really does show us nothing sympathetic or positive about Meereen, whereas every culture in Westeros has some degree of nuance – even the Ironborn, who are pretty atrocious, have a quasi-democratic system that the Seven Kingdoms lack; I think that’s a flaw in the books). You can’t govern people effectively without some empathy for the way they look at the world.
@32, Well I think a part of that comes from the fact that Jorah cared for her when she was nothing more than another mare for the Khal to ride.
@33:
On Narnia: what you describe is part of her critique. If you have some interest and quantities of time, you can check out the decon at
http://www.anamardoll.com/2011/02/narnia-narnia-deconstruction-index-post.html
On ASOIAF: I’d say the characters are on a much wider and muddier spectrum of nice-to-nasty. And only we the readers can decide if a given character becomes “redeemed” or “fallen” in our minds, leading to a vast variety of opinions, of which GRRM’s (if he ever expressed them off-page) would honestly carry about as much weight for me as anyone else’s.
Well, if Dany decided to leave for Westeros now, then why take Meereen in the first place? That would mean that all the people who died during the battle and the sack died for nothing, since things would surely return to the status quo as soon as she leaves (or something even worse happens, like it did in Astapor which got a “butcher king”, and we are reminded of Astapor’s fate for a reason in this chapter). As soon as Dany committed to her liberation crusade in Slaver’s Bay, she was stuck there for a long time, because a just leader cannot just stop halfway and abandon the people who put their trust in her (and many of them had lost their lives too).
Jorah’s advice was not bad actually. There is no guarantee that Illirio would not have screwed Dany over once she arrived in Pentos with Dragons but without an army. The idea of buying some Unsullied to protect herself from possible betrayal from Illirio was sound and practical. The quest to liberate all the slaves was Dany’s own noble idea.
The thing is, he’s not wrong. Slavery is immoral and unjustifiable, but as an argument about the inescapability of inequality it can’t really be refuted. Look at his quote again: he isn’t saying anything about some people being inherently worth less than others, he’s just saying that in order to get any of the advances that come from having leisure time, the leisure class needs an underclass to do the crap-work.
And it’s true. As Americans we owe everything we have to buying goods and crops that are produced for us overseas, often in near starvation conditions. And before that, chattel slavery and the genocide of the natives. And before that, brutal British conquest. Before that, brutal conquest OF Britain by other European powers. And back and back and back…
Hell, western civilization grew out of ancient Greece, and that was only possible because slaves did all the work, giving the citizens time to be philosophers and playwrights.
NOT defending the system, NOT saying it’s right. But it is TRUE.
It is definitely not naive of you to call out the sheer wrongness of it, because it is wrong-wrong-wrong. However, it may be just slightly naive to think that doing so means you aren’t a part of it.
@34. Jon does do a good job with the wildlings. The problem is he’s not supposed to be a wilding leader, he’s supposed to be the leader of the Nights Watch. And I don’t know that he has as much empathy for the NW mens worldview.
Dany is in kind of a similar situation – she identifies with and has sympathy for the ex-slave part of the population of Mereen. But she’s also supposed to be the leader of the great masters segment of Mereen, and as you said, she hates them all.
33. Iarvos
Actually the Susan thing is why the end of those books bugs me so much. She becomes a young woman, and I guess strayed away from the fantastical world she spent time in when younger, and because of that is denied heaven, losing her whole family in the process?
It’s not written that she turned into a drunk driving animal torturer or something. It was very harsh.
Lisamarie – it is a wheel of time reference from this week’s post. Jordan likes to have minor characters come back in later books (like Mili). Looks like GRRM also follows the law of conservation of characters.
RobMRobM – I follow that thread too, I was just trying to figure out what the connection was! But Mili on the other hand also seems to have leveled up considerably.
39. bookworm1398
Well, only an idiot can’t see the effect that thousands of extra wights would have, and Marsh and Co. fit that bill.
Loyal. Stannis converted him from a nobody to nobility. That’s worth a few finger joints.
Yes, but Stannis also lifted Davos up from petty smuggler to a lord with properties/lands. He went from being someone at the bottom of the social ladder, in danger of being executed for his activities, to someone near the top of the Westeros feeding chain. And, IIRC, he “only” lost the first joint of the fingers on his left hand, not the entire finger. If you were to offer people today an equivalent exchange, say $5 million for the loss of the fingertips on one hand, most people would probably take that deal.
Re: Davos’ fingers. Davos was raised to a knight for saving Stannis’ forces from starvation. One might argue that a different ruler would let Davos keep his fingers as part of the reward. But Stannis is as inflexible as they come. I agree though that I’ve come to like Stannis a lot more because of his (positive) interactions with Davos and later Jon.
As for Xaro/Qarth not gifting more ships, well ships can be used for military purposes. Give Dany a whole fleet and she may well use it against Qarth. She’s basically pulled that same trick before with the Unsullied. IMO the ships weren’t a good offer, and not meant to be either. Remember the coalition was already assembling against her.
@31 Dany isn’t perfect, but I think you’re giving her too little credit. I don’t agree at all that her forces come entirely from Illyrio. She built her own power, through magic (turning those useless egss into dragons), through betrayal and deceit (the Unsullied), and through military force. And in any case, she’s made no agreements with Illyrio – everything was freely given, to achieve Illyrio’s own aims. I don’t feel that Dany is beholden to him at all.
It’s hard to say whether she’s morally right or wrong in what she does, especially in a series that delights in painting everything morally grey. I mean, the only way to not do anything morally wrong probably is to quietly accept retirement in the desert as the khal’s widow. It’s not like the
Yunkai, Meereenese and Dany’s other enemies were entirely blameless either.
(roll over for possible spoilers) @39 Jon’s job is to defend Westeros from the Others. Recruiting the wildlings to help with this seems like a good idea. Even doubters like Bowen Marsh seemed to accept this, if reluctantly – they only turned on Jon when he was going to interfere with the South.
Hmm, I can’t remember, are we already past the point where /
Stannis makes Davos his “Hand”
/?
Which, now that I think about it, is kinda awkward. Symbolism much, GRRM?
@7 : in A Storm of Swords, Dany was always winning. It’s more fun than watching the constant train wreck that was Cersei, but I think it’s still more interesting to see her struggle. But it’s true I liked more the Jon chapters, for which I agreed with the decisions and their justifications. True, it’s probably the fact that there is less indecision from him, but Dany’s chapters are interesting for the fact that there is no good solution to her problems.
Regarding the ships, the masters of Qarth want slaves: conquering an empty city is much less interesting. Also, more ships could be used against them, which would make for a really stupid defeat.
@37 Good points, but I always have to question why people think Dany leaving Meereen means it will regress. I will admit that’s a likely possibility, but most people seem to think her only option is to pack and leave like she was never there. Why can’t she appoint someone? She could create a council, get them to work together to lead Meereen, and then go once it’s functional. Still a chance it would fall into disarray, but that’s a problem with any government.
And this is why I think of Dany as a naive ruler–because she never even seems to consider this approach. She sees it as a) only she can rule or b) only evil people will rule. She’s a tyrant at heart, but refuses to see it. And sure, for the most part she’s a benevolent dictator, and I would sure rather her than some of the other contenders in the series–I’m just pointing out that she seems incapable of thinking anyone else as capable of ruling and so ends up martyring herself needlessly.
And I get she’s got a lot of trust issues too, and not really undeservedly. But it is part of why I grit my teeth every time I read this book.
@38 Well said. Pretty much the case until we reach post-scarcity. I don’t see any other way for there not to be some kind of working class vs the elite/rich/liesure class–no matter what your personal economic or political stance is, there will never be complete parity until resources aren’t an issue.
@@@@@ 49. Any council Dany left behind in Mereen would face the same ultimatum from Qarth as she does : Resume slavery or else. They wouldn’t last long.
I think with the whole Davos/Stannis relationship and how it’s been discussed here, one thing that always should be brought up is that these books are one unreliable narrator after another. In a way, that’s my favorite part of the series. You can see a person or event through the eyes of one person in one chapter and then see things through a different person’s eyes in another and get both of their biases, leaving you to try to figure out what is reality.
Now, when it comes to actual rulers, so far, Dany and Cersei (a regent who basically decided she was queen) are the only ones we’ve seen from their viewpoint (I don’t count lords or high-ranking admins such as Ned or Tyrion as being on the same level as a king/queen).
With Dany, every bit of her stuff we’ve gotten are her viewpoint chapters. Other POVs have mentioned her in passing (typically Westeros people wondering how much of an obstacle she might be in theory) and a whole bunch are converging on her (Tyrion, Quentyn, Victarion), but we get to spend a lot of time in her head to know that, regardless of how she’s this weird combination of completely indecisive thoughts followed by EXTREMELY decisive actions, that she’s a good person at heart (at least comparitively speaking) who really wants to do the right thing, but is finding out the hard way that doing the right thing for some equals doing the wrong thing for others and that being a ruler sucks.
With Stannis, you only really get that sort of sense into his mind indirectly via Davos, where he basically acts like it’s mentally caving him in, but due to his ironclad, rigid sense of duty, he’s going full bore towards being recognized as the king. With most other POVs, he’s more an object of ridicule due to being an hilariously bad “people-person” and the big first impression of him on-page was in direct conflict with the infinitely more charismatic Renly. And with the only other we’ve had to this point that goes into Stannis more (Jon’s), there’s the added bit of how Stannis’ presence is a bit annoying because Jon just wants to worry about the Wall, but Stannis keeps on him about Winterfell and stocking the castles and land rights and other things, so he comes off as overbearing.
It’s all about perspective. All things considered, Dany probably isn’t as good as she is in her view (I mean, we aren’t far removed from a chapter where, in retaliation for some of her people getting killed by Harpys, she gave Shavepate permission to torture the family of a person suspected of being involved) and Stannis probably isn’t as bad as he is in most others’ views. Anyone who can earn the loyalty of Davos to that degree AND who will drop things to save the Wall from a wildling invasion is most likely a lot better than most of the main king/queen candidates. Even the occasional human sacrifice via fire seems downright friendly compared to the stuff that various Boltons and Lannisters have been willing to do to ensure their status in society.
@49. “And this is why I think of Dany as a naive ruler–because she never even
seems to consider this approach. She sees it as a) only she can rule or
b) only evil people will rule”. She’s well aware of this approach, she’d done exactly this in Astapor. We’re seeing just now how it unfolds and there is no reason anyone could suspect that doing the same in Meereen (even with more time to help them start) would be any bit more successful after the dragons are not in the eyeshot.
@49 Well, I think the story shows that just the opposite is true. The idea that Dany can just smash the evil slavers quickly, leave a good council behind and move on was the naive one. Because that is exactly what Dany did in Astapor, except that it didn’t work. The council was almost immidiately overthrown by the “butcher king” and things quickly became even worse for the astapori then they were before the sack.
Supposedly Dany may leave a more competent and loyal person to rule in Meereen then she did in Astapor (I cannot think of any candidate among Dany’s advisors who would be both politicaly competent, loyal and devoted to the anti-slavery reforms at the same time, but lets just say she finds one). She could also leave a part of her Unsullied behind to ensure that this new ruler is not removed by a coup. But even that still won’t work, because without Dany’s army and the dragons Meereen will soon fall to Yunkai and their allies, who (aided by the Son’s of the Harpy from inside the city) will restore slavery and undo everything Dany has done.
Also many people forget that the conquest of Westeros by Dany that they wish for is of a rather dubious morality. In Slaver’s Bay her cruel sack of Astapor and Meereen is justified by the fact that the people who got killed and sacked were slavers responsible for terrible crimes such as the “training” of the Unsullied. In Westeros there are no slaves to free, and the common people of Westeros, as we have been told many times, are actually the ones who suffer most in the Game of Thrones. (It is thematicaly important actually that that phrase is first said by Jorah in his conversation with Dany back in the first book). And then we get the chapter where Drogo’s army sacks a Lhazareen village, lots of innocents are raped and killed, and Dany thinks to herself that “this is the price of going home”. (Then she attempts to save some of the women from rape, but it ends in disaster). In Slaver’s Bay Dany is helping people (or at least trying too), in Westeros she will be a conqueror, not a liberator. (Not to mention that she will need to kill Tommen, an innocent child to take the throne. Myrcella too, most likely.) So people who wish for Dany to return to Westeros are actually wishing for her to choose a darker path.
(Now it may very well be that Dany and her dragons are required to go Westeros to save the world from the Others, or at least that is what maester Aemon concluded afetr hearing about dragons, and what archmaester Marwyn seems to believe now after hearing Sam’s story. But Dany doesn’t know anything about the Others yet, and the only reason for her to go to Westeros at this point is to claim the throne. So at least with the information she has staying in Meereen is an unambigously moraly correct choice.)
You need people to do the meainal jobs, regalrdless of who they are. If you are including economic equality in your true equaility than yes you are incredibly naive and actually dangerous. People are people, but that means honestly very little. What you do while being a person determines your worth, what you earn, and how much respect you get. SO SAY WE ALL!
“breasteseses”
Is that an obscure Lady Sovereign reference?
On Davos in White Harbor – this is a chapter where the action is all about the internal. This is one of the most loyal, morally incorrupt persons in the whole sprawling mess, and he actually considers slinking off instead of doing what he’s come for. It’s watching that shining code of conduct of his catching a couple more dents and scuffs. It’s the post-naval battle, I have lost my sons, my boat, was cast up naked on to a rock, Davos, struggling to remain true.
But too true about the GRRM descriptions: I want some fried cod like that, now! With beer.
And about the sexual floor show with real sex in it – I’m pretty sure Robert Heinlein did that, decades ago! But can’t remember what book it was in. I think maybe I Will Fear No Evil?
Critizising Dany for trying but not quite succeeding in abolishing slavery is a bit like victim blaming for me. She is doing her best to correct injustices and even if curently there are former slaves suffering it is nothing compared to the millions that died for thousands of years because of slavery and the millions that could be dead in the future. Do you remember how in Astapor it was explained how only 1/3 of the slaveboys survived the training? And how all the Unsullied boys were made to kill a baby? So that is 30 thousand dead for Dany’s Unsullied alone. And in these cityes the amount of slaves were absurdly high, something like 70%. While many may be suffering I would assume most of their lifes have wastly improved. And if she fails it is a noble failure, she did not have an ulterior motive for conquering.
You’ve just forgotten, since you actually named the person in your post for “A Read of Ice and Fire: A Feast for Crows, Part 27.” Just part of the problem with a slow read on a sprawling saga with a gazillion characters.
@38 The thing is, that sort of inequality is even less defensible in the modern world than it is in ASOIAF’s pre-industrial setting. Because when the main source of power is the human muscle, someone has to do the heavy lifting. But doing the heavy lifting is a miserable lot in life, one that very few people would choose, so some people end up forced to do it. It might seem more fair to distribute the heavy lifting evenly, but in practice that means hunting-and-gathering or subsistence farming across the board, and gods help you if you’re not born able-bodied. But once industrialization gets going, there are plentiful sources of power to be harnessed besides the human muscle, so forcing people into slavery becomes unnecessary as well as evil. I don’t think it’s a coincidence that all the successful abolitions of slavery have happened in industrialized or industrializing societies. Mind you, we still use horrendous labor practices because the free market values a desperate human less than a piece of machinery, making it cheaper to use the first one. But that’s an outgrowth of the capitalist economic system we use, rather than the inescapable way the world works, and we could theoretically fix it. So the fact that we don’t is on us.
Looks like sooner Davos will have free time to visit Essos rather than Dany will invade Westeros. =D
Dany herself should also have demanded enough ships to take all Meereen with her.
Dany is really good at winning wars – and even better at losing the peace. Child has NO understanding of political economy, economy economy or power politics.
Cleaning up the Ghiscary cities is a lifetime project and you CANNOT bring down a civilization – and does this civilization ever deserve to be brought down! – without tons of collateral damage. It is a project that requires somebody a lot more ruthless and better trained in cut throat politics than Dany.
I do not know if you remember, but at the end of SoS Daenerys decides to stay to learn to reign.
And that is exactly what is happening: bridging a thousand problems that are extremely necessary for your personal and political evolution.
Imagine, if she can not rule Meereen, can she ever rule the Seven Kingdoms?
She has to stay.
.
.
And it is a fatal truth that she will arrive as a “conqueror” in Westeros. I’m afraid of how this will end …