Welcome back to the Words of Radiance Reread on Tor.com! Last week, Shallan continued to have neither shoes nor a boyfriend. This week, Kaladin continues to have neither self-esteem nor the respect of the priestly class. Have-nots, am I right?
This reread will contain spoilers for The Way of Kings, Words of Radiance, and any other Cosmere book that becomes relevant to the discussion. In particular, this week will contain material that may spoil sections of Warbreaker for those who haven’t read it yet. Go read Warbreaker! It’s relevant! The index for this reread can be found here, and more Stormlight Archive goodies are indexed here. Click on through to join the discussion.
Chapter 16: Swordmaster
Point of View: Kaladin
Setting: Lighteyes’ Sparring Grounds
Symbology: Spears, Ishar
IN WHICH Kaladin, Moash, and Drehy discuss their disappointment in the Lighteyes’ sparring grounds; an ardent tries and fails to put Kaladin in his place; Kaladin points out that a place full of weapons and Shardblades is, in fact, a dangerous location; the King’s Blades are discussed, and Kaladin commits a gaff; Amaram’s sins are discussed; Kaladin worries about the writing during the highstorms; Syl tries to cheer up Kaladin, is met with sullen resistance; she very reasonably suggests that Kaladin talk to Dalinar about Amaram, and is shot down immediately; Adolin and Renarin arrive; Kaladin respects the chain of command, which does not include Adolin; No love is lost between the two; Sylphrena makes many cryptic noises about Shardblades; Kaladin spots Zahel and moves to engage; Zahel admits that he is likely to be chosen as Renarin’s swordmaster; Syl insists that she is godly.
Quote of the Week:
“You all seem odd to me,” Syl said lightly. “Everyone but Rock, who is a complete gentleman.”
“He thinks you’re a god. You shouldn’t encourage him.”
“Why not? I am a god.”
He turned his head, looking at her flatly as she sat on his shoulder. “Syl…”
“What? I am!” She grinned and held up her fingers, as if pinching something very small. “A little piece of one. Very, very little. You have permission to bow to me now.”
I’ve always been tickled by this exchange, which is why I included it in our Glimpses of Radiance campaign. It seems silly, but is in fact very significant for those continuing the hard work of deciphering spren mechanics. Syl’s not lying when she claims to be a little piece of a god, which gives more evidence to support the idea that spren are splinters of a broken Shard. Maybe that’s why she has A+ levels of justifiable self-esteem. Learn from her example, Kaladin!
Commentary: I will never stop being displeased by plots that rely on characters not talking to each other. Syl forces Kaladin to admit, in no uncertain terms, that he does trust Dalinar and believe that he’s a good man. He doesn’t suspect Dalinar of being another Amaram, of talking a big game but being capable of massive betrayals. And yet he still drops bitterbombs of this variety: “It’s not a big deal. Dalinar Kholin is friends with one of the worst murderers I’ve ever met. So? Dalinar is lighteyed. He’s probably friends with a lot of murderers.” While it’s true that Dalinar isn’t going to just drop Amaram on the first piece of rumor Kaladin brings him, Dalinar is a tactician and he isn’t prone to throwing away important facts about his enemies or allies just because they’re inconvenient. People in this book could have made so many better decisions. I really just wanna take Kaladin and shake him.
I like the conversation at the beginning of this chapter about Drehy and Moash’s expectations of the sparring grounds. There are some things that even great wealth have some difficulty dressing up. But, as Kaladin points out, the sparring grounds still gain value for the lighteyes by maintaining exclusivity. Even if they’re functionally similar to the darkeyes’ sparring grounds, they aren’t tainted by association. Also they have, like, baths and cultivated rockbud decorations and a host of ardent sparring partners. So there’s that.
I know that ardent is looking for any reason to pick a fight with Kaladin (after all, what’s the point of a restricted-access clergy directly patronized by the nobility if not to maintain class divisions), but her methods of attack were weak as damnation. She attacks his right to be there by his rank, which is clearly labeled on his shoulder, and when that fails she tries to insist that he’s not necessary. There are Shardblades. The literal most dangerous thing. I think she’s blindfolded by the idea that lighteyes are constrained by some kind of honor code that would prevent them from assassinating another lighteyes during sparring. But if so, why? Assassination seems like it’s on page one of the lighteyes handbook that I assume they give out on the first day of lighteyes summer camp.
Someone help me, I sound like Kaladin this week.
One thing I am very fond of in this chapter is the depiction of the former members of the Cobalt Guard. These guys respect Kaladin and Bridge Four so absolutely that they want to make them their primary allegiance, but Kaladin is wise enough to make them keep their old Cobalt Guard patches. It’s refreshing to see a few elite soldiers who are actually acting like they believe in meritocracy, in a chapter that is so much about negative class relations.
Sprenspotting: Sylphrena has been keeping an eye out for weird spren like weird lightning for a while now, but apparently they’re hard to spot. Ominous! Angerspren also make a brief appearance this week, because anger follows Kaladin around.
Ars Arcanum: Syl’s ongoing hatred of Shardblades continues to drive us closer to our inevitable realization of What They Really Are. She says that she doesn’t like anyone who carries Shards, and that the Blades are abominations now. However, when the Radiants had them they weren’t abominations. I wonder whether Plate is equally abominable to Syl, and if so, why. It’s going to be hard to find out, sadly, because Syl is bound to fall silent whenever this topic goes too far. Yeah, I’m still mad about information flow, what of it?
Haven’t We Met Somewhere Before?: HI ZAHEL! WELCOME TO THE PARTY, PAL! Zahel is a fairly prominent secondary character in Words of Radiance, but a far more significant character from Sanderson’s earlier novel Warbreaker, which is set on the shardworld Nalthis. His name in that book is Vasher, a.k.a. Kalad, a.k.a. Peacegiver the Blessed, a.k.a. Talaxin, a.k.a. Warbreaker the Peaceful. He kind of hogs titles, but you can’t really blame him considering that he’s one of the Five Scholars and one of the most powerful and clever magic users of that planet. It’s not super clear how he got to Roshar yet, or what his plan is, but his persistent use of literally colorful language and occasional reminiscences about voices in his head (coughcoughNIGHTBLOODcough) make his identity easy enough to guess.
Heraldic Symbolism: Ishar provides over this chapter, tsking at all the ardents who are failing to be either pious or guiding. You really could’ve taken a more active hand in their religious upbringing, Ishar. If I were you I would be totally disappointed.
Shipping Wars: I know that some of you must hateship KalAdolin. If so, this is a chapter for you. Don’t you just want to smush their angry faces together until they kiss?
That’s it for this week! Alice will return next week as Shallan continues her slave caravan pleasure cruise up the Frostlands.
Carl Engle-Laird is an editorial assistant at Tor.com, where he acquires and edits original fiction. You can follow him on Twitter here.
Vasher! Yay, Vasher! WHERE IS NIGHTBLOOD? Oh- he’s with WHO? NOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
Hmmmm…There’s other stuff going on in this chapter, but the presence of Vasher drives all other thoughts out of my head. Why is he there? Is he looking for Nightblood? Did they separate before or after he got to Roshar? HOW did he lose Nightblood? What’s going on?
Syl’s statement about being a tiny piece of a God is true, if you accept that Shards are gods. But if you think about the fact that all the Shardbearers were mortal humans before they took up the pieces of Adolanlsium, then I guess they’re not, they’re just mortals with God-like powers. Maybe I’m just nitpicking, but Dalinar’s thoughts on how Honor cannot be God if he’s dead seem pretty accurate to me. Now if someone were to collect pieces of all 16 Shards and unite them, that might be a different story…cough…Hoid…..cough…….
I don’t hateship them. It’s probably ’cause I read the book fast enough that they started getting along before I could do more than coo at them for their adorableness together. Besides, Shallan would not stand for her boyfriends being so adversarial. She’s had enough of living in a house full of hatred, thank you.
@1, is that what Hoid’s trying to do? I think he’s playing a subtler game.
I ship Syl + Nightblood
Is Zahel/Vasher one of the 10 Heralds? Does Wit know Zahel and vice versa. Do they know that the other is a worldhopper?
Thanks for reading my musings,
AndrewB
I will never stop being displeased by plots that rely on characters not talking to each other. – Well, in a way I agree, and in a way I’ve learned to accept it… I read (and rererereread) the Wheel of Time, after all! While I’ll admit to a certain frustration when characters don’t talk to each other, I’ve also concluded that a lot of times, it’s more reasonable that way. It’s just not natural to tell someone everything you know on the off chance that there might be some tidbit that they need; there must be a valid reason to share that particular bit of info. But there has to be a valid reason to withhold it, too – especially in a case like this. Here, it boils down to whether or not you think Kaladin’s reasons for not talking to Dalinar about Amaram are… well, not valid, because they aren’t, but at least in character and humanly comprehensible given his background and circumstance.
Re: Kaladin & Adolin… Noblehunter @@@@@ 2 says, “I don’t hateship them. It’s probably ’cause I read the book fast enough that they started getting along before I could do more than coo at them for their adorableness together.” That’s both the blessing and the curse of beta-reading: we got to read roughly one part each week. That meant one night of blazing on through to read the story (!!!) and another 5-8 days of rereading looking for discontinuities. It makes you experience ALL the frustration of their stupid annoying (totally believable) smack-their-heads-together snotty attitudes toward each other. GRRRRRR. On the other hand, it makes the reward all the sweeter when they each recognize that the other is worthy of their respect, and they actually become friends… or proto-friends, anyway. :)
(I also loved the way they still snark at each other later – it’s just that later, it’s in fun rather than bitterness, which is completely in-character for the both of them. Which it wouldn’t be, if they were all “no word against My Buddy” nice to each other.)
AndrewHB @@@@@4 – I have a looney theory that Zahel is Ishar… but nothing solid to back it up, and some WoB that may rule it out if I go do all the research. I don’t know if Wit and Zahel know each other or not; if they do, I’d be pretty confident that Wit would recognize Zahel as a Worldhopper, but much less the reverse.
@5, I’ll hate the beta readers less now. That sounds extraordinarily painful. But storms I want to know what happens.
@@@@@ large (heh)
–Ishar might also represent the sinewy, fleshy aspects of the arena.
–It was Moash who drew the angerspren (danger, Will Robinson).
–It was interesting to note Syl has control of some physical aspects of Roshar. She “summoned” a small cloud with lightning when she was perturbed.
–We received a clue about Dalinar’s wife–maybe she is from Rira.
–Same pick for QOTW. It was one of my favs in the Glimpses.
–“Plots that rely on characters not talking to each other.” That isn’t a reference to WoT, is it? But yeah.
–The illustration: Why on Roshar would Nazh’s benefactor want Shallan’s drawing of Pattern recovered? If that person is a worldhopper (presume yes), wouldn’t (s)he already have a firm grasp of the cognitive realm and spren?
Annnd the epigraph (expectantly awaiting Wetlandernw’s comment on this topic). I read it as: Nimbleform defied the gods in the distant past (during desolations) and was crushed. “This form craves…plenty” suggests greed. Did Listeners in this form get too big for their britches in a quest for power or material goods? The former seems more likely. Or, if Listener gods are truly of Odium, perhaps the Nimbleform did something to aid Honor or Cultivation’s cause and seriously ticked off Odium. Or maybe time has significantly altered the meaning of this stanza and it means something entirely different. A literal interpretation of a sort-of prophecy can be very misleading, dontcha know.
AndrewHB @@@@@4
IIRC, it’s been confirmed Vasher is not one of the Heralds.
Edit typos.
Noblehunter @6 – Yes, please don’t hate the beta readers… :D There are advantages and disadvantages. On the plus side, you get to read it sooner!!! You get the joy of being involved in the creation of a work of art, even if you don’t have the skills to be the master. You may get the thrill of seeing one of your suggestions show up in the book – usually vastly improved upon, but you can recognize the seed. And let’s not forget the fun of seeing your name in the Acknowledgements, even if no one else reads them. :) On the minus side, you’re reading a version with noticable imperfections, and you must not only notice them, but search them out, because it’s your job. You read it, but you can’t talk about it with anyone except the other beta readers. You have to be excruciatingly careful with your comments on the reread, because you know things you officially “don’t know” yet. And, in a case like this with a huge book on a tight schedule, you may get it in pieces and have to waaaaaait for the next chapter! It also takes a lot of time; you have to have a life where you either have plenty of free time, or you have the freedom to put other things on the back burner for days at a stretch.
I personally love doing it, whether it’s a beta or gamma read, but it’s definitely not for everyone.
Wetlandernw @8
My dilemma is how to get your signature on the appropriate page. It would be a welcome addition to several others.
I read the acknowledgements, at least until I get to the list of names which I just skim for people I know. I get inordinately pleased by seeing my authors conspiring together on their books.
But you get to know things! Sooner! And maybe con Brandon into letting you know other things! I mean, the more you know the better you can beta, right?
You have my respect for enduring the agony of endings so many times. I couldn’t, even if I had the brain capacity for proper beta reading. Once per book is more than enough for me.
I have a feeling that Zahel will become a key figure by the end of the series. I can envisage a final confrontation between Nalan, whom I see as Odium’s champion, and Kaladin. Nalan wielding Nightblood is about to kill Kaladin after a furious battle, when Zahel tells Nightblood that Nalan is the evil one. Nightblood then turns on his wielder and destroys him.
AndrewHB @@.-@
At the very least, Zahel knows Hoid. When Kaladin asks Zahel about him later in the book, Zahel calls him Dust, which is apparently another psuedonym of his.
I really do not think Zahel is a former Herald. He does not show the characteristic brokenness or moral inversion of the Heralds. But it does beg the question why he decided to make his own pseudo-shardblade. I think he tried to make a magic blade, and what he got was a spren-blade, that in many ways, is a shadeblade.
@8 – I would LOVE to be a beta reader for those first two reasons alone. I’ll read books multiple times (which keeps my book buying budget under control) and enjoy noticing something new every time. The only one of your negatives that would really be an issue for me is the amount of time it takes. But … sleep is optional, right? Then I’m all good. :)
I’ll admit that I didn’t recognize Vasher at first. I assumed from his odd mannerisms and sayings that he was from some other part of Roshar, not another world entirely. It did finally click, but not in this chapter.
STBLST @@@@@ 11: Nalan as Odium’s champion. Interesting. But not something I forsee. Nalan is one of the Heralds. I have a hard time believing that one of the Heralds (even if it this moment, something has adversely affected the Heralds after they surrendered their Honorblades and refused to return to the place they went to between Desolations) would go so far as to be a champion of Odium.
Thanks for reading my musings,
AndrewB
Welp time to finally go buy Warbreaker
I think you can find it online for free, depending on how you are willing to read it. It is the online novel Brandon has released that way.
I’ve read Warbreaker twice, and still have no clue of how anyone could identify Zahel with Vasher.
Vasher has been around for hundreds of years. The Heralds have been around for thousands of years. I don’t think Vasher could be a Herald.
18. Alphaleonis
Most of the hints are only clear in retrospect. I certainly didn’t see it until Nightblood showed up. And once we saw Nightblood, then we immediately look for a swordsman, especially one who uses such ‘colorful’ metaphors.
This chapter reminded me of my doubts about Renarin being the writer of the countdown warnings in Dalinar’s room.
[/quote]We have all assumed from Renarin’s confession of being a Truth watcher at the end of the book that it was Renarin who was doing the graffitti. But, was he? Once again, I ask myself: how did Renarin sneak past Kaladin to get into Dalinar’s room, write on the wall, and sneak back out undetected? Maybe Truthwatchers have the Talent to pass through walls? All jokes aside, maybe Brandon is waving a red herring in front of our eyes…
Syl’s statement about being a tiny piece of a God is true, if you accept
that Shards are gods. But if you think about the fact that all the
Shardbearers were mortal humans before they took up the pieces of
Adolanlsium, then I guess they’re not, they’re just mortals with
God-like powers.
Spren aren’t a piece of the mortals who hold a Shard, they are a piece of the Shard itself (which is a part of Adonalsium).
Once again, I ask myself: how did Renarin sneak past Kaladin to get into Dalinar’s room, write on the wall, and sneak back out undetected?
Renarin was probably already in the rooms. If Kaladin’s men guarded the entrances, but were not inside the rooms, they didn’t necessarily see Renarin move around inside the rooms.
Truthwatchers use Illumination, is it not possible he just snuck around using illusions?
Also we don’t know how skilled he is yet, what if he had been disguising himself as someone else like Shallan/Veil? We, or anyone else in the novel, would have no idea.
I still have problems with Kaladin’s disrespectful behaviour against “his betters.” It’s not out of character and it’s not bad writing, but it’s definitely not clever. I perfectly understands why he feels as he does, but I’m not so happy about him not keeping a tighter control on what’s showing outside.
Dalinar might protect him against Adolin and the ardents are technically slaves but I feel he is displaying his irreverence too freely under the pretext of “I’m a bodyguard, so I don’t have to defer to anyone at all, because this messes with my bodyguard-duty.”
Re Zahel, on my first read I suspected Zahel to be Ishar. I first “figured this out” at I-6 and believed it to the end, until we discussed it in the spoiler thread. Just wanted to point that out, because reading Carls comment it seems as if it’s crystal-clear, while I think BWS did a great job of “hiding it in plain sight”.
And, I don’t think that there are any hints yet (in this chapter) that Zahel is Vasher.
Ways @@@@@7: @@@@@ large (heh) — Heh, indeed :)
Renarin was probably already in the rooms. If Kaladin’s men guarded the entrances, but were not inside the rooms, they didn’t necessarily see Renarin move around inside the rooms.
From the way Kaladin has been concerned about the first graffitti incident, and from reading closely his musings above, it seems clear that he, Kaladin, personally stood guard on Dalinar’s actual room during the high storm. He is sure nobody could have snuck past him. Well, someone did, but how?
So has there been official word from Brandon that Zahel is Vasher, or is it just a connection fans have put together that seems highly likely. I ask because I really didn’t see that particular connection at all until I finished reading and went online to see what everyone else thought.
In fact, on my first read-through, I thought Zahel was a failed Windrunner. The role he plays for Kaladin towards the end of the book made me think that Zahel had, at some point in his life, faced a similar choice to the one Kaladin faces, but he (Zahel) made the Wrong choice, and he tries to help Kaladin make a better one. Also, in one of the interludes, there’s a line about how, as he’s heading to bed, Zahel half expects to hear a voice in his mind, but knows he won’t. Put that line together with Zahel making a Wrong choice, and I originally thought that the absent voice indicated that Zahel was once bonded to a spren, but lost the bond.
On my second read through the signs really point to Vasher.
Not just the colourful words, but there are several moments where Zahel knows who is coming, even behind a closed door. So he still has the power of breath that gives him the sense to know when someone is close.
And of course the moment Veovim mentioned, where he half expects to hear a voice in his mind, really seems to point to Knightblood.
Veovim @26
From the San Francisco WoR signing:
Q: When you were planning Zahel being Vasher, how long did you do that?
A: Vasher was in the 2002 version of WoK by name. I only changed him to the new name after I finished this entire draft. Because I was like, oh he’d probably go under a pseudonym. So he’s been in Roshar 12 years our time.
I’d say he’s listening for Nightblood in the interlude passage you mention.
World hoppers can sometimes be spotted because they have an accent that isn’t recognizable. Once you think someone is a world hopper it’s a little easier to look at the other details to see who they might be.
Although, I have seen one person with a strange accent that I’m not sure about but we’ll get there in a little bit.
Completely off-topic, but if I wait until it is on-topic, I will have forgotten.
My daughter is reading about Eleanor of Aquitaine because we realized we happen to be related to her. Eleanor was the mother of King John and King Richard the Lionheart, from the Robin Hood stories.
One interesting thing my daughter pointed out, was how much her father (William the 10th) sounded like Elhokar. A deeply ineffectual king, constantly living in the shadow of his father, prone to whining, etc. While on the other hand, Eleanor was shrewd, politically savvy, very intelligent and highly educated from a young age, and very used to getting what she wants, and good at getting it. She sounds a lot like Jasnah.
I have no idea if any of this is intentional, or if this is just a case of well-written art resembling real-life, but I will keep an eye out as I learn more about both Eleanor and Jasnah.
OK, so now I know why no one bit on my compliment of the characters of Denth & Tonk Fah in an earlier post. Thought no one loved me anymore.
And I would have probably never guessed Zahel was Vasher.
@31 I was tempted to say something devious about Denth and Tonk Fah for you, but I thought better of it.
@31: If it helps, I really really liked Denth at first too. His betrayal hit me hard in the gut. At least I liked Lightsong even better.
So guys, if Vasher is Ishar, he broke the Oathpact, THEN traveled to Nalthis, THEN died, THEN Returned, THEN did all the stuff that Nalthis attributes to “Kalak” and creates Nightblood and stuff, THEN went through the actual events of the books Warbreaker and Nightblood, THEN returned to Roshar. Which … surprisingly, is all plausible. Makes you really think about just how long these Heralds have been kicking around — maybe they’ve gone nuts sheerly through boredom? ;-)
But IF Vasher is Ishar, it would make sense that he’s much less severely deranged than the other Heralds, because he’s died and come back to life as a Splinter of Adonalsium. On the other hand, this would probably mean he has a lot of re-learning to do about what being an Herald entails.
one thing i really love going back through this book, is looking at kaladin during his more bitter moments, and realise that after what we learned in oathbringer, he often is completely right, though never in a way he would think.
Here, his bitterness and hatred is directed at the one lighteyes he currently trusts, Dalinar kholin, making him in haste say that he might be just like all the others, with Syl angrily getting in his face about it.
turns out though, He’s completely right. Dalinar is in a sense just pretending to be a good man. he never grew into a good person by taking responsibility for his actions and growing into a better person. he instead ran away from them, and had a god rip the things he hated about himself out of his mind. he might be a good man, but he is not the true dalinar kholin by any measure. he is a person that was formed by cultivation wiping the worst aspects of him from existence and only leaving his positive aspects left. he is in essence a man who had the worst aspects of himself cut out and removed to help him pretend he has become a better man.
Dalinar will eventually take responsibility for his actions and grow into a better person, but at this point, he really is what Kaladin in his haste accuses him of being. a lighteyes just like all the rest.
@34 It makes me wonder how Dalinar’s book will hit Kaladin. In one hand he’s further along in his oathes so it may not be AS hard, but it will STILL be a wammy